CTV News Report on Left Lane Hoggers

[Mancini]

Originally Posted by ICE BOY

Raising the limit won't prevent people from being shitty drivers.
IMO the signs should read "KEEP RIGHT EXCEPT TO PASS" and they need to actually enforce it. I'm sure if there's a week long crackdown on left lane blockers (as with seatbelt checks), people will start getting the message.

QFT!
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[bing]

Originally Posted by BlueG2

highway or not, if you are going 10km over the limit, and are "hogging" the left lane, you are doing others a favour by preventing them from getting a potential speeding ticket . I agree that the right lane should be for "slower" drivers, but what is the definition of "fast" and "slow" by LAW it should really mean right lane is for anyone who chooses to go under the legal limit. The "fast" lane should obviously be for passing, but should you really expect to be ALLOWED to go faster than the maximum limit?

It's not your job to be policing others. If you actually have that attitude you are pretty self-righteous. It literally takes no effort to move to the right and it reduces road rage on the roadways making it safer for everybody.

[Geoc]

Originally Posted by BlueG2

highway or not, if you are going 10km over the limit, and are "hogging" the left lane, you are doing others a favour by preventing them from getting a potential speeding ticket . I agree that the right lane should be for "slower" drivers, but what is the definition of "fast" and "slow" by LAW it should really mean right lane is for anyone who chooses to go under the legal limit. The "fast" lane should obviously be for passing, but should you really expect to be ALLOWED to go faster than the maximum limit?

In that case, the tailgaters are doing you a big favour by putting themselves at risk to keep you from getting a ticket for violating MVA 150.1(a)

[subordinate]

Originally Posted by bing

That's when you brake check the little bitch.

This attitude doesn't help.

[SpartanAir]

I've always thought it has to do with North American Culture.

When I was driving in Europe about 7 years ago, I drove thru Germany, France , Austria, Switzerland and Italy. And aside from parts of Italy, people generally were very aware of the passing lane(s).

I remember when I was in France, I would see people passing me who left their turn signals on; They would get in the passing lane, leave the signal on so everyone saw they were passing at speed, then return to the right lane and turn it off.

Lane hogs don't really exist; in Germany on the Autobahn, if you stay in the left lane, and blink, you suddenly have a huge BMW come up on your ass and tailgate you until you move over, then they blast by at 200+ kmh. People just seem to be taught not to stay in the lane.

But as I said before, I think it's a cultural thing. In North America, especially the US, there is a sense of entitlement and consumerism built into society. A selfish attitude that you get to do whatever you want because you deserve it; I'm going the speed limit, so I can drive wherever I want to.

I don't think it's conscious most of the time, I think it's built into the way most people here are.

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by SpartanAir

Lane hogs don't really exist; in Germany on the Autobahn, if you stay in the left lane, and blink, you suddenly have a huge BMW come up on your ass and tailgate you until you move over, then they blast by at 200+ kmh.

This sounds like driving in Quebec!

People just seem to be taught not to stay in the lane.

I dunno, according to my buddy who lived in Ottawa for several years, drivers out there keep right simply out of fear...

[iEatClams]

Originally Posted by SpartanAir

I've always thought it has to do with North American Culture.

When I was driving in Europe about 7 years ago, I drove thru Germany, France , Austria, Switzerland and Italy. And aside from parts of Italy, people generally were very aware of the passing lane(s).

I remember when I was in France, I would see people passing me who left their turn signals on; They would get in the passing lane, leave the signal on so everyone saw they were passing at speed, then return to the right lane and turn it off.

Lane hogs don't really exist; in Germany on the Autobahn, if you stay in the left lane, and blink, you suddenly have a huge BMW come up on your ass and tailgate you until you move over, then they blast by at 200+ kmh. People just seem to be taught not to stay in the lane.

But as I said before, I think it's a cultural thing. In North America, especially the US, there is a sense of entitlement and consumerism built into society. A selfish attitude that you get to do whatever you want because you deserve it; I'm going the speed limit, so I can drive wherever I want to.

I don't think it's conscious most of the time, I think it's built into the way most people here are.

Agree and disagree, I've lived outside of the lower mainland and in alberta, and people are way better at keeping to the right land than the people in Greater Vancouver.

I have a feeling it has to do more with the poor drivers that lack skill and awareness of the rules. And I find that a higher % of them are of the asian kind (C-Lai jokes). Just my observation, but others may disagree with me.

Weird thing is all the asians that I know that grew up here who are in their 40s and 50s know the rules, but the asian immigrants that recently moved here from Asia dont.

Weird thing is I have asian relatives in the USA and this is their biggest complaint as well, and they say all the new asian drivers that have recently immigrated there are the worst culprits of not keeping right except to pass on highways. Maybe it's a cultural thing.

[Graeme S]

I can almost certainly guarantee you that this is primarily because of the fact that our highways are two lanes in most places instead of three.

Why is this important? Because old people hate the anxiety of merging. And the right lane, in addition to the 'driving' lane is also the 'merge in and out' lane. So if I drive from Burnaby (Cassiar) to West Van (Taylor Way), and while it's a highway, it's almost completly two lane all the way, and most of the places where it's only two lanes are the places where there's lots of merging. I take the left lane through almost the entire stretch partly because I have a minor case of leadfootitis, but also because I don't want to deal with the retardedness of idiots trying to merge and driving too slowly or merge where there's no space...


If there were three lanes;
passing | travel | merge in/out

then the whole fucking thing would be infinitely better--old people wouldn't have to be afraid of traveling in the 'travel' lane, the passing lane would be free for actual passing and you'd be able to merge in and out freely.


On that stretch, there are two parts of the highway that actively freak me out:
Eastbound where Mt. Seymour parkway merges onto the #1. The amount of traffic that comes out of there and the lack of length of merging (and poor speed on the leadup) makes me ridiculously nervous. Add to that, people who are freaked out about the merging will suddenly cut into the fast/passing lane to avoid the cluster fuck.

Eastbound the Capilano Road exit/entrance. People have a habit of stopping on the merging ramp because there's literally no way to tell when people are going to keep going or take the exit, so you'll sometimes have people accellerating like a motherfucker to try and get a gap that they just can't make because they stopped.


If we had three lanes, my drive there would make me less freaked out about not-driving in the passing lane.

[bing]

Originally Posted by subordinate

This attitude doesn't help.

I'm well aware that it constitutes aggressive behavior.

[nma]

The best is when there's heavy traffic and you're in the left lane with the rest of the flow, and some idiot sees an opening on the right lane, floors it past you just to slow down... then you just end up passing him again LOL... I've seen this way too many times and it cracks me up

[iEatClams]

Originally Posted by Graeme S

I can almost certainly guarantee you that this is primarily because of the fact that our highways are two lanes in most places instead of three.

Why is this important? Because old people hate the anxiety of merging. And the right lane, in addition to the 'driving' lane is also the 'merge in and out' lane. So if I drive from Burnaby (Cassiar) to West Van (Taylor Way), and while it's a highway, it's almost completly two lane all the way, and most of the places where it's only two lanes are the places where there's lots of merging. I take the left lane through almost the entire stretch partly because I have a minor case of leadfootitis, but also because I don't want to deal with the retardedness of idiots trying to merge and driving too slowly or merge where there's no space...


If there were three lanes;
passing | travel | merge in/out

then the whole fucking thing would be infinitely better--old people wouldn't have to be afraid of traveling in the 'travel' lane, the passing lane would be free for actual passing and you'd be able to merge in and out freely.


On that stretch, there are two parts of the highway that actively freak me out:
Eastbound where Mt. Seymour parkway merges onto the #1. The amount of traffic that comes out of there and the lack of length of merging (and poor speed on the leadup) makes me ridiculously nervous. Add to that, people who are freaked out about the merging will suddenly cut into the fast/passing lane to avoid the cluster fuck.

Eastbound the Capilano Road exit/entrance. People have a habit of stopping on the merging ramp because there's literally no way to tell when people are going to keep going or take the exit, so you'll sometimes have people accellerating like a motherfucker to try and get a gap that they just can't make because they stopped.


If we had three lanes, my drive there would make me less freaked out about not-driving in the passing lane.

Interesting, I always thought about this too, and may explain that part of land, but it doesnt explain the stretch from brunette to say abbotsford, where you still see many people in the left lanes and two cars are going the same speed blocking you from passing on a weekend. Most people are not merging onto the hwy during the stretch, but mostly coming off.

[Soundy]

They're talking about this on CKNW right now. Listen online: AM980 Listen Live

[Everymans]

graeme s put it in perspective. A lot of the lane hogging problem is relative to the poor highway infrastructure of this city. North van has some of the sketchiest merges I've ever been on, same with the entrance to the massey tunnel(5 lines into 1?! who's stupid idea was that!). hwy1 out to the valley seems to be mostly poorly educated drivers though, most of the merges are long and simple. It would help if it were 3 lanes, which they're working on. It should also be noted that highways inside a city vary considerably from highways between cities. what with all the merges and vancouvers lack of lanes. I normally keep to the left lane until I need to get my exit if i'm in a hurry, or i'll stick to the right and putt putt along at the speed limit. You can call me a lane hogger all you want but I'm always doing 10 over the speed limit, no need to do more inside the city.

[mac25]

-use traffic tickets to fund two non speed governed lanes
-let car enthusiasts move freely and happily
-let low speed preferenced people have their slow lanes

-everybody wins

=D

[JaPoola]

In Europe they have MANDATORY driving school. And the tests are way harder. The L here is useless when you are driving with a bad driver and picking up all their bad habits. Another difference is the people there like to drive, and they like to drive fast. They're passionate about it, because driving there is mostly a luxury, not a necessity, like it is here.

And most driving schools here suck balls. I see China driving school all the time on the highway to Richmond doing the speed limit or less in the left lane. Blind leading the blind much???

[Rich Sandor]

I agree that a major problem is the design of the ON ramps. Take Capilano Road merging unto Upper Levels highway. Everyone moves to the passing lane because the merging traffic has NO SPACE to speed up to highway speed. It's a gong show, thankfully it's rarely as busy as the rest of HWY #1.

The other MAJOR gripe I have is the HOV lane. People travel in the centre lane which is actually the passing lane. You can't go into the HOV lane to pass and you aren't supposed to pass on the right. And the speed limit along much of HWY1 in vancouver is 80kph but everyone is doing 100kph, except for the odd person actually obeying the rules.

Then on top of that, if you are trying to teach a New Driver (as a driving school instructor) you HAVE to stay UNDER the speed limit.. which is hugely frustrating for EVERYONE involved.

I wish we would install telematik electronic speed limit signs like they have in WA state between Bellevue and Downtown Seattle (They started in Germany about 30 years ago!!!)

[Rich Sandor]

Even the fucking Hungarians have it, and we don't in Canada. Thats downright ridiculous. (I'm Hungarian, so I can say that!)

[bing]

^It's Canada where things happen slow..ly

Welcome to the world of Canadian bureaucracy.

[mac25]

Originally Posted by Rich Sandor

I agree that a major problem is the design of the ON ramps. Take Capilano Road merging unto Upper Levels highway. Everyone moves to the passing lane because the merging traffic has NO SPACE to speed up to highway speed. It's a gong show, thankfully it's rarely as busy as the rest of HWY #1.

The other MAJOR gripe I have is the HOV lane. People travel in the centre lane which is actually the passing lane. You can't go into the HOV lane to pass and you aren't supposed to pass on the right. And the speed limit along much of HWY1 in vancouver is 80kph but everyone is doing 100kph, except for the odd person actually obeying the rules.

Then on top of that, if you are trying to teach a New Driver (as a driving school instructor) you HAVE to stay UNDER the speed limit.. which is hugely frustrating for EVERYONE involved.


I wish we would install telematik electronic speed limit signs like they have in WA state between Bellevue and Downtown Seattle (They started in Germany about 30 years ago!!!)

No. vancouver did have speed cameras, the public voted them out. you're telling me when it's a perfectly clear night, there's no one on the highway back from abottsford th summer night is well light, that you choose to stay at a speed under 100kph?


well that's fine for you i'm guessing you're the play it safe type. but don't wish to ruin other peoples fun who enjoy higher speeds by introducing a government run, big brother, freedom limiting camera system.

I understand that one should not be so selfish as to endanger others lives or property of others. that's one thing but no one has the right to tell me how, if and when i can endanger my own, no one.

[Graeme S]

Originally Posted by mac25

No. vancouver did have speed cameras, the public voted them out. you're telling me when it's a perfectly clear night, there's no one on the highway back from abottsford th summer night is well light, that you choose to stay at a speed under 100kph?


well that's fine for you i'm guessing you're the play it safe type. but don't wish to ruin other peoples fun who enjoy higher speeds by introducing a government run, big brother, freedom limiting camera system.

I understand that one should not be so selfish as to endanger others lives or property of others. that's one thing but no one has the right to tell me how, if and when i can endanger my own, no one.

Where did he talk about cameras? He's talking about speed limit signs that can change based on conditions.

[Gridlock]

On the subject of driving school...I took young drivers at 16 and it was rediculous. All they did was give a cursory concept of the rules of the road and spent the rest of the time teaching you to pass the drivers exam-which in itself was a cursory 20 minute exam, which I took in a small town with a handful of stop lights.

Bullshit...absolute bullshit. No defensive driving, or skills that would help at all.

Plus my instructor was a dick, so wins all around.
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[CP.AR]

this is why I love driving on the interstates. (mostly) everyone follows the "keep right except to pass" rule. The ones that don't obey this rule either has BC plates or an old person.

once you cross the border... WTF mode engage

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by JaPoola

In Europe they have MANDATORY driving school. And the tests are way harder.

Lots of places in North America have mandatory driver's ed. Where my wife went to high school in a Chicago suburb, driver's ed was part of the curriculum. In 30+ years of driving, she's had no tickets and only two accidents, neither of which were her fault. Oh... and she drives like a fucking maniac most of the time.

I'd lay good money down that if ICBC had taken all the money they've blown on the GLP, and used it instead to fund driver's ed in the high school curriculum for kids just starting to learn to drive, it would have been FAR more effective in the long run.

[.Renn.Sport]

hong kong is actually very good at enforcing the fast lane law. i've actually had times the cops made me go back to the middle lane cuz i wasn't driving fast enough (about 20km above the speed limit....)

[Rich Sandor]

Originally Posted by mac25

No. vancouver did have speed cameras, the public voted them out. you're telling me when it's a perfectly clear night, there's no one on the highway back from abottsford th summer night is well light, that you choose to stay at a speed under 100kph?


well that's fine for you i'm guessing you're the play it safe type. but don't wish to ruin other peoples fun who enjoy higher speeds by introducing a government run, big brother, freedom limiting camera system.

I understand that one should not be so selfish as to endanger others lives or property of others. that's one thing but no one has the right to tell me how, if and when i can endanger my own, no one.

First of all, I never mentioned speed cameras, so I don't know why you even brought that up, unless you didn't read or understand my post.

My whole point was that it's ridiculous that we have the same 80kph speed limit on the #1 during rainy, dark, rush hour, and during clear, empty sunday morning. Obviously other countries have figured out that safe speed limits change with traffic and weather. We just put one speed limit thats sometimes too high and sometimes too low.

If you want to endanger yourself - that's fine. I never said I give a shit if you endanger yourself or not. The problem is, you THINK you are only putting yourself at risk, but then you run out of luck and talent and wind up taking an innocent life with you unexpectedly.

I've done the stupid crazy fast speeding on public roads. In retrospect, I realize how DUMB it was, and I don't feel the urge to do it anymore. I've spent enough time around cars to know that suddenly the most unexpected thing can go wrong and put you in the trees due to no fault of your own, and the faster you are going, the more likely you are going to DIE. I realize that some people refuse to learn from other people's mistakes - I can't stop that. But, hopefully I can convince those that ARE smart enough to learn from my mistakes. Take it to the track.