[Confidential] Getting married at a young age

[El Bastardo]

The following is a post from an anonymous Revscene member. If the original anonymous member would like to respond to this thread, please feel free to PM me

I've been going out with my girlfriend for almost 4.5 years now. We started dating in high school and we were both our first serious relationship. We're currently both 21, she is finishing university this year and I've been working in my career field for about 2 years.

I really love her and I see my self being with her for the rest of my life. She's everything you could ever ask for in a gf or a wife. I know it sounds very cliche but she truly does complete me. We compliment each other very well. She loves me as well and she wants to spend her entire life with me too. We have been talking about marriage a lot lately and I've been getting ready to propose and ask her parent's for their blessing and permission to marry their daughter.

Money isn't that much of an issue but since we've started talking about marriage I've been trying to save my money a lot more now. Kind of living more "frugal". Ideally I would've liked to get married at around 26-27 but marrying now will allow us to do the things that we couldn't do before. We are also not just getting married because of that. Getting married at 26-27 means that we would've been able to spend 5-6 years saving up our money instead of just a year or so and that way we wouldn't have to rent and instead put a down payment towards a house.

It seems like there is a lot to pay for when getting married:
1) Wedding
2) honey moon
3) place to live

Roughly how much would everything cost? We've estimated about like 20k but we really want to get it down as much as possible. We've got quite a bit of family and friends in Vancouver and it'd be hard for us not to invite them. We would also be the first ones getting married out of our circle of friends.

Also, where would you guys recommend looking at getting a ring? I've heard it should be 3 months pay but there is no way I would spend that much money on a ring. I want it to be nice but not too expensive. I think my budget would be like $1-3k (does that even get a nice ring?) but I can go higher but would prefer not to. What should I look for as well?

And for those of you who proposed and asked for their parents permission, how did it go? Did you take them out to dinner or just casually ask them together.

Thanks guys!

[Gnomes]

Originally Posted by El Bastardo

The following is a post from an anonymous Revscene member. If the original anonymous member would like to respond to this thread, please feel free to PM me

Also, where would you guys recommend looking at getting a ring? I've heard it should be 3 months pay but there is no way I would spend that much money on a ring. I want it to be nice but not too expensive. I think my budget would be like $1-3k (does that even get a nice ring?) but I can go higher but would prefer not to. What should I look for as well?

That 3 month salary -> De Beer made up that rule of thumb. Dont fall into their trap. $1-3k does sound reasonable. An engagement band (with no rock) will cost roughly $800 at Spence.

If you go to the states, they have cheaper diamond rings compared to Canada. I am talking ~10-20% cheaper. Costco USA do sell engagement rings too. If you choose to no declare it (I do not encourage nor judge you for doing so), I would recommend mailing the paperwork to your home address and somehow carry the ring discreetly

[dinosaur]

Don't spend a lot on the ring. As you get older, you will always be able to add to it or upgrade is she would like to.

So, you ask how much a wedding, honeymoon, and a place to live? My friend, thats up to you. You can get married for $1k if you want and honeymoon in Victoria.

I say this without trying to sound like I am talking down to you, but you are young. PLEASE don't spend 1000s on a wedding. Shit adds up fast and at the end of the day, it does't matter what type of flowers you had or how many people you invited. This is better understood the older you get. It really doesn't matter. 10 years down the road and 3 screaming children, nobody will care if your wife's shoes costs $15 or $500.

My suggestion....find a place to live first. I think couples should live together before marriage. You need to realistically understand what it takes to be married. 21 is YOUNG! Trust me....I think back at the person I was at 21 and I shake my head.

You can save just as much money not being married as being married.

[6793026]

the FIRST question you have to ask " hey gf, how much are you going to chip in?"

if she can't take you seriously then you need to work that kink shit out first.

wedding would be like 20-30k, OH, if you want to invite all your high school buddies and all, sure.. then you're looking for a 40k wedding.

Oh, you want to live in a richmond oval new apartment... OH sureee. let's save up 100k down payment.

FIJI and Bora Bora for honey moon, sure, that'll cost 5k.

I ran throw those questions with a gf and then she realized 1) not only does she has to also save money, but 2) money don't come out from a money or my own ass.

reality hit pretty fast when they realize they also have to contribute too.

[bcrdukes]

Originally Posted by El Bastardo

[I]And for those of you who proposed and asked for their parents permission, how did it go? Did you take them out to dinner or just casually ask them together.

Thanks guys!

I won't go into details but the last time I did that, the dad brought out a brand new Louisville Slugger.

[westopher]

Originally Posted by dinosaur

My suggestion....find a place to live first. I think couples should live together before marriage.

This is the most important advice in this thread. Spending every moment together, the weirdest things start to bother you. The way someone puts their toothbrush in the holder can lead to problems. Its fucked. Once you handle living together, then you will have a real idea of what things are going to be like. Fuck traditions, set yourself up for a successful marriage. Me and my wife to be have now lived together for a year, and we fight less than ever. Its really important to feel what its like to live together. It creates a totally different dynamic to the relationship.

Don't spend 20k on a wedding. Its one day. All it needs to be is your friends and family in a room, with some food to eat and booze to drink. You don't have to impress anyone, and nobody remembers your 5k flower arrangement, but they do remember how happy they were to see you, and all of your friends and family having fun. I spent about 3k on an engagement ring at spence. They were super helpful, and didn't try to pressure me to up my budget at all. As for our wedding, we are at about 6k for 140 people. The food is our biggest expense, the venue was less than 1000, and that 6k includes her dress. After buying some booze and renting suits we may hit 10k, but its going to be pretty rad, and no need to spend tons.

[Marshall Placid]

A lot of costs are based on what you are willing to forego and look back on in the future.

Sometimes, it is peer pressure on what your friends or people you know did.

Or, what your parents or her parents want to "show off".

Who is paying? Her parents? You? You and her? I am presuming it is you and her, not parents.

You can only ever have 1 wedding (debatable, but lets just say... 1 wedding).

You should try to make it as best as an occasion you can, with what you can afford.

Women, in my personal opinion (and based on friends, etc.), are much more picky on their wedding. Best thing? Consult your girl-friend.

Are you trying to "tie up" your girl-friend? If so, do this:
Propose to her. Now, you are engaged. Make wedding date 2 or 3 years from proposal date. Now, you have plenty of time to save up and prepare.

--------------------
You mentioned something about first married couple in your circle of friends:

Once you get married, it is still the same old routine with friends = no problem.

Once you get kids... now... that will be different. You'll be taking care of the baby for several months before you can bring him/her out. And, even then, you'll be spending 20% to 40% of your time at the event (with your friends) taking care of the kids. Just something to think about.


---------------------
In any case, in regards to your 3 questions:

1-Wedding:

LOWEST cost:
Go to the city-hall and sign the papers (they might also have a small area where guests can sit down and see you sign the papers.
Low-key/cost:
$10k to $20k
Average:
$20k to $30k
High:
$40k+


Most of the cost will be the wedding banquet. $50 per head, or $500 per table for normal/average Chinese food. $100 per head for above average food.

BOOK EARLY!!!!!!!!!! at least 6 to 8 months in advance if possible.

This is the same for West-coast Pacific cuisine at around $75 to $85.

A lot of cost, 30% or more will be on the wine. WATCH OUT! You can always set a limit of 1 or 2 bottles per tabble.

Flowers: $1k to $3k.

Wedding dress: You can rent one for $500 to $600, or buy for $1k to $5k (your GF can look for deals for "outdated" or "used" wedding dresses... something to pass down to chidren?)

Photographer and photography and videography:

This is a biggie and varies. $500 to $5k.

Limo: $750 or you can borrow one of your parents or friends' car.

can't think of other expenses right now...

2-
Honeymoon:
Do you REALLY need a honeymoon?

If you don't want to spend the $ or don't have the $, postpone it.

Place to live:
Low on money?

Rent, easy solution.

Or, live with your parents (not ideal, but it does happen).

Buy a starter house (referencing my point about putting the wedding off until a few years later, but PROPOSE now....).

------------
Ring?

Cubic Zirconia.

Or other new synthetic diamonds.

IMHO, nobody can really tell the difference, and it boils down simply to a case of what you, yourself and your GF really feel when buying a synthetic ring.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_diamond
Or, if your GF is really insistent on a REAL ring, but is okay with.... "anything", don't take her spoken words as true... If she is insistent, she wants a real one. Talk to her and discuss.

Parents' permission?

Easy:
If you guys have been together for that many years, and her parents know about this, and your parents and her parents meet at least once a month... that should be no problem... unless their parents disapprove your relationship... OR... the age (which I understand)... So, it is even more important to emphasize that you will be married a few years after the proposal (if that is what you are planning to do: marry a few years later).

But, the bottom line is that it is your life and her life, and you guys get to do whatever you want, regardless of parental permission.

However, I just want to note you guys will have a much easier married life with parental permission (relationship with parents, etc.).

Anyway, good luck.

[xilley]

read OPs post and suddenly mello popped in my head.. could it be?

[tiger_handheld]

subscribed.

[PJ]

One of my best friends is getting married in a couple months, and they're 22.

They don't make a lot of money, but they get by, and they're the happiest/nicest couple in the world. Seriously, you give these guys a 7-figure cheque, they'd donate it straight to charity.

They're renting an apartment, and everything else, they're just going to figure out together. And there's two ways you can look at that...
One, why not plan everything ahead while they have the chance?
or Two, the journey of getting their lives in order is something they want to experience together.
Answer will be different for every couple.

I don't see anything wrong with either option.

They've been together since they were like 15 or something, so when I asked him if he was ready, he said "I don't see myself ever being with anyone else, so now's as good as a time as any."

Everything else cost-wise, depends on how fancy you guys want the rings, wedding, parties, honeymoon, etc to be.

I personally do think 21 is young, and I could never do it myself. So I admire people who are able to take that leap.

Good luck with everything sir.

[Spoon]

Originally Posted by El Bastardo

Money isn't that much of an issue but since we've started talking about marriage I've been trying to save my money a lot more now.

When it comes to a wedding, and it seems like you want a traditional one to boot ($$$cha-ching$$$), money is the only issue.

I'd recommend posting a breakdown of your numbers first to see what you actually budgeted for from people who have actually been through it before. 20k might be doable for an Asian wedding, might be on the lower side for a western style one. Had a relative who held a wedding at the Pan Pacific before, and he paid through his ears cause they charge for absolutely every fucking thing.

To be honest, even though he dumped a small fortune on it, deep down, I bet nobody gave a fuck.

[El Bastardo]

The following is a reply from the anonymous original poster

Originally Posted by Gnomes

That 3 month salary -> De Beer made up that rule of thumb. Dont fall into their trap. $1-3k does sound reasonable. An engagement band (with no rock) will cost roughly $800 at Spence.

If you go to the states, they have cheaper diamond rings compared to Canada. I am talking ~10-20% cheaper. Costco USA do sell engagement rings too. If you choose to no declare it (I do not encourage nor judge you for doing so), I would recommend mailing the paperwork to your home address and somehow carry the ring discreetly

Ah I see! I'm def not going to fall into that trap :P.

I'll take a look in the states and see what they have. ~10-20% is a good amount of money to save. Do they tax 12% coming over? What if it was made in the USA lol.

Originally Posted by dinosaur

Don't spend a lot on the ring. As you get older, you will always be able to add to it or upgrade is she would like to.

So, you ask how much a wedding, honeymoon, and a place to live? My friend, thats up to you. You can get married for $1k if you want and honeymoon in Victoria.

I say this without trying to sound like I am talking down to you, but you are young. PLEASE don't spend 1000s on a wedding. Shit adds up fast and at the end of the day, it does't matter what type of flowers you had or how many people you invite. This is better understood the older you get. It really doesn't matter. 10 years down the road and 3 screaming children, nobody will care if your wife's shoes costs $15 or $500.

My suggestion....find a place to live first. I think couples should live together before marriage. You need to realistically understand what it takes to be married. 21 is YOUNG! Trust me....I think back at the person I was at 21 and I shake my head.

You can save just as much money not being married as being married.

Yea I don't want to spend too much on the wedding as it's just one day. There are a lot of other things that I would rather spend that money on things for the future. I'm pretty sure my gf wants to have a nice cute wedding (she's very crafty as well so I'm sure we'll cut costs this way too).

Unfortunately, she comes from a very traditional and religious family so we would no be able to move in together until we do get married. She is very respectful of her parents and has a very good relationship with them.

I've tried suggesting it numerous times but she knows her parents will not allow her to. She always says: "If we're going to get married in the future why not get married first?"

I know 21 is young but (un?)fortunately my life has kind of been going in a "accelerated" route :P (especially in terms of my relationship and career lol). Although I did miss out on the University exp by going to BCIT.

[dinosaur]

Originally Posted by El Bastardo

The following is a reply from the anonymous original poster

Unfortunately, she comes from a very traditional and religious family so we would no be able to move in together until we do get married. She is very respectful of her parents and has a very good relationship with them.

I've tried suggesting it numerous times but she knows her parents will not allow her to. She always says: "If we're going to get married in the future why not get married first?"

See...its shit like this that annoys me. This isn't directed entirely towards you, but it is VERY important that you live together before you commit your LIFE to a person.

Marriage is a MUCH BIGGER commitment than living together and the fact that you (the universal you) need to seek approval from parents to do so shows that there level of maturity is not high enough to get married.

Like I said...you are 21. That is young. Why the rush? Saying you want get married so you can live together is a poor reason.

[westopher]

You know whats way worse than pissing religious and traditional parents off? Your own divorce. They may be mad, but if they care about your relationship, and the both of you, they will understand. I had the same issue with my girlfriends mother, but I had the balls to say that this is the only way to realize if we are able to be together FOREVER, is if we can handle being together now.
P.s. I really hope you don't think I'm trying to discourage you, or shit on your values. Just trying to let you know lots of people have had to go against someones wishes for their own benefit and success.

[dinosaur]

Originally Posted by westopher

You know whats way worse than pissing religious and traditional parents off? Your own divorce.

THIS!

[Mr.HappySilp]

Originally Posted by dinosaur

See...its shit like this that annoys me. This isn't directed entirely towards you, but it is VERY important that you live together before you commit your LIFE to a person.

Marriage is a MUCH BIGGER commitment than living together and the fact that you (the universal you) need to seek approval from parents to do so shows that there level of maturity is not high enough to get married.

Like I said...you are 21. That is young. Why the rush? Saying you want get married so you can live together is a poor reason.

Agree 100% even for my gf and I we usually stay together over the weekends and there things that I didn't expect and so is my gf. I am sure there are more of these will come up.

EG. she is pretty neat, me on the other hand not so neat but I am learning -D
also she doens't eat junk food which I eat a lot of......

[melloman]

Living with someone is a completely different world then just seeing someone.

You have to be able to communicate very well. When your upset, you can't just "go home" or avoid them. You have to talk it out or it will boil up and explode. You will see this person the majority of your day, EVERYDAY.

I am personally going to buy a place, move in with my girlfriend, and then think of marriage. If you can't live with someone 24/7/365, and learn to love their FLAWS then your going to be FUCKED very quickly. As you'll already be married, have dumped tons of money into that, and now you'll need to get seperated/divorced. (Don't forget this isn't free either)

21 is a young age. I'd really sit down and think about everything and plan your life out.

[dinosaur]

And, its not just about flaws and random idiosyncrasies...

-how do you divide household chores?
-who cooks? who cleans?
-what groceries do you buy? do you eat the same meals together?
-do you do your own laundry? does someone do it all and the other put away?
-financial issues: joint account for household expenses? who puts what in? is it a % of monthly income? is it an even amount? does one pay the rent\mortgage and the other pays for utilities? insurance? who is in charge of paying the bills?
-who pays when you eat out? what happens when one has money and the other doesn't?
-what time do you get up in the morning? what time do you go to bed?
-do you share a car? each have a car? who pays for gas when you are both driving together?
-What are your expectations of the other in regards to going out with friends? boys night? girls night?
-Whose family do you visit for holidays (Christmas, etc)?
-Socializing at your place (hosting parties), etc. Do you want to come home to a house full of females after a long day a work? Does she want to come home to a house full of dudes playing video games after a long day?
-what are you expectations about sex? 3 times a week? once a week? daily?
-are there kids in the future? does one parent stay home? daycare? family? how many kids?

The list goes on and on and although it may seem like stupid shit, this is the stuff that nags at you when you get frustrated. This is the shit that divides a couple after a while. This is the shit you need to know AND experience BEFORE you get married. Nobody likes to plan an exit or discuss these very un-romantic topics, but to have a successful relationship, you need to.

Like melloman said, how do you fight\argue\disagree when you can't just 'go home'?

An ideal situation would be you both living together and functioning well for at least a year before you sit down and SERIOUSLY consider committing your life together.

[Mr.HappySilp]

^^ this and also little things/habits you have, your partner might hate it so do they put with it or do you change?What if your partner sores?
One thing I liek to add if you do decide to live with gf make sur eif you don't see a future with her split before 2 years is up. There is a new law in BC if you live someone for 2years or more it becomes common law and you pretty much if you seperate after 2 years all your assets is split 50/50 and you now have to pay her debt as well if she even any (even she if had them before you move in with her).

[J89]

Originally Posted by dinosaur

See...its shit like this that annoys me. This isn't directed entirely towards you, but it is VERY important that you live together before you commit your LIFE to a person.

Marriage is a MUCH BIGGER commitment than living together and the fact that you (the universal you) need to seek approval from parents to do so shows that there level of maturity is not high enough to get married.

Like I said...you are 21. That is young. Why the rush? Saying you want get married so you can live together is a poor reason.

I don't know how I feel about this post, I agree for the most part and see your concerns, but I don't think that it's necessary for everyone to live with their mate before marriage. I think in life not everyone marries the person they are meant to be with, and in this case there would be need for one to live together first to understand each other more. And then their are the ones who know, sounds like OP found the one. They have a whole life together ahead of them and each part is a new journey. If they truly loved each other than I'm 100% they will be fine in the future. I honestly think that is the bottom line.. As for seeking approval from the parents, I don't know if OP is asian, but I'm going out on a limb to assume he is. Parents are single handedly the most important peoples in our lives. Lets just pretend the parents don't approve I think It's very important and find out why they don't approve because there must be a good reason in their eyes wouldn't you say? I don't know maybe I'm crazy.

[skiiipi]

Originally Posted by dinosaur

And, its not just about flaws and random idiosyncrasies...

-how do you divide household chores?
-who cooks? who cleans?
-what groceries do you buy? do you eat the same meals together?
-do you do your own laundry? does someone do it all and the other put away?
-financial issues: joint account for household expenses? who puts what in? is it a % of monthly income? is it an even amount? does one pay the rent\mortgage and the other pays for utilities? insurance? who is in charge of paying the bills?
-who pays when you eat out? what happens when one has money and the other doesn't?
-what time do you get up in the morning? what time do you go to bed?
-do you share a car? each have a car? who pays for gas when you are both driving together?
-What are your expectations of the other in regards to going out with friends? boys night? girls night?
-Whose family do you visit for holidays (Christmas, etc)?
-Socializing at your place (hosting parties), etc. Do you want to come home to a house full of females after a long day a work? Does she want to come home to a house full of dudes playing video games after a long day?
-what are you expectations about sex? 3 times a week? once a week? daily?
-are there kids in the future? does one parent stay home? daycare? family? how many kids?

The list goes on and on and although it may seem like stupid shit, this is the stuff that nags at you when you get frustrated. This is the shit that divides a couple after a while. This is the shit you need to know AND experience BEFORE you get married. Nobody likes to plan an exit or discuss these very un-romantic topics, but to have a successful relationship, you need to.

Like melloman said, how do you fight\argue\disagree when you can't just 'go home'?

An ideal situation would be you both living together and functioning well for at least a year before you sit down and SERIOUSLY consider committing your life together.

Wow this is a good list!
I lived w/ an ex for 4+ years, and this list would've came in handy before we moved in together....
Cause your right, seems like little stuff now, but addes up very quickly.
Posted via RS Mobile

[dinosaur]

The thing about the list, is that you don't HAVE to agree about everything...and answers will change over time. This is where melloman is right when he says that you need to communicate and keep the dialogue open.

There is an ebb and flow to everything. The key to having a successful relationship is knowing when to give and take. There may be some weeks where one is so busy with work that the laundry doesn't get done and the other person takes the lead on chores....or there maybe be weeks where one person doesn't want to have sex 3 times, etc.

The key is not to get pissed off and refer to this "list" that was discussed prior to commitment, its about having that person's back and understanding that it was an 'off' week for the other.

The list shouldn't be looked at as a set or rules but more guidelines or a catalyst to provoke an adult conversation. Relationships aren't always full of rainbows and cookies....some times you need to separate that stuff to have important "life" conversations without fear or judgement from your partner.

Some times it is good to have a "check-in" talk with your SO. "So...how are you doing?", "How are we doing?", etc

[rsx]

Having had live-in girlfriends in Vancouver from my late teens to late 20's, I can absolutely agree that living with someone does increase the amount of friction. You can have a nice list, open dialogue. But when you both come home from work, exhausted, grumpy or stressed, all bets are off.

I would say, live with your girl first, or at least have a longer engagement and see how it works out.

[Marshall Placid]

Originally Posted by Mr.G

I don't know how I feel about this post, I agree for the most part and see your concerns, but I don't think that it's necessary for everyone to live with their mate before marriage. I think in life not everyone marries the person they are meant to be with, and in this case there would be need for one to live together first to understand each other more. And then their are the ones who know, sounds like OP found the one. They have a whole life together ahead of them and each part is a new journey. If they truly loved each other than I'm 100% they will be fine in the future. I honestly think that is the bottom line.. As for seeking approval from the parents, I don't know if OP is asian, but I'm going out on a limb to assume he is. Parents are single handedly the most important peoples in our lives. Lets just pretend the parents don't approve I think It's very important and find out why they don't approve because there must be a good reason in their eyes wouldn't you say? I don't know maybe I'm crazy.

Good points.

It's hard sometimes to simply just say "Yes, lets live together before we get married and see how it goes".

It depends on a lot of factors, including, as Mr. G stated, PARENTS' opinions and cultural views.

In any case, lets put the "cultural" issue aside.

I personally thing, IMHO, that it is not an absolute must to live together before getting married.

Marriage, for most people, is a work in progress. You learn new things about your partner, and you forgive, forget, argue, debate, whatever. This is the joy of being married: you learn new things.

Lets say... they decide to live together first. Lets just hypothesize that one of them is EXTREMELY messy. Because of this trait, would the other partner then decide to cut ties? They aren't married yet, so it is easier to cut ties.

Lets say... they decide to get married first. Then, the messy trait is discovered. Now, would they divorce? Well... they shouldn't. They should work through this. It is a something married couples do all the time (improve and compromise, etc.).

My point is that, if a couple is not married, there is less room to compromise. There is an easier route: breaking up.

If a couple is married, then they try harder to work through routine things and negative traits, so breaking up is not immediately thought about first.

As long as the underlying foundation is true love, idiosyncrasies (perfect word BTW dinosaur +1 and EXACTLY used properly in this context) and nuances between the partners always melt away. Basically, love conquers all.

But yes, money and a lot of big issues are big factors in most things, especially in marriage. They should plan, and plan ahead. This does not necessarily mean they should live together before getting married.

In any case, the point of living together first before marriage is moot.

The confidential OP is basically asking us if he should get married now, and it looks like he WANTS to do it, but unsure about the challenges and costs that lie ahead. And, the OP adamantly emphasizes the fact that they love each other completely. The way he describes it is that they are 100% in love. Small issues and personal idiosyncrasies are simply tiny paper roadblocks.

[Gridlock]

Originally Posted by dinosaur

Like I said...you are 21. That is young. Why the rush? Saying you want get married so you can live together is a poor reason.

Sex? Maybe she's that level of traditional.