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Old 05-13-2014, 06:45 PM   #101
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There are some industries where unions are or would be beneficial, but MOST unions today are simply not doing what they were originally intended for, and are abusing their power.
so where is the line? who gets to decide which industries should have a union and which ones shouldnt?
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Old 05-13-2014, 07:14 PM   #102
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Maybe not wanting every job to be minimum wage while the company racks in billions in profit has something to do with it.
So instead the workers collect strike pay, which amounts to a fraction of minimum wage, and even IF they make a deal eventually for a pittance raise, it will never be enough to make up what they've lost while standing on the picket line.

And of course, the union continues to take their cut in union dues, so what the fuck do they care?
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Old 05-13-2014, 07:38 PM   #103
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So instead the workers collect strike pay, which amounts to a fraction of minimum wage, and even IF they make a deal eventually for a pittance raise, it will never be enough to make up what they've lost while standing on the picket line.

And of course, the union continues to take their cut in union dues, so what the fuck do they care?
Yeah they are pretty fucked given the circumstances. Where I used to work a picket line meant no one was allowed to cross it to work there, so the company essentially shut down until the issues were dealt with. Being as Richmond is the only unionized Ikea here, and it still remains open, they have very little bargaining power.

Not really relevant to this while union thing but I liked Bill Maher's rant on billionaires and distribution of wealth

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Old 05-13-2014, 11:03 PM   #104
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so where is the line? who gets to decide which industries should have a union and which ones shouldnt?
I said there may be some that could benefit, but in the other half of my post, I said that there are also other ways to regulate. So no one draws the line, the few industries that could hypothetically benefit from unions can deal with their issues in other ways. (regulatory bodies, labour laws, etc)
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Old 05-15-2014, 11:18 PM   #105
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Older article, but good read about the situation.

“The Richmond store has been underperforming all the other stores in Canada. They have the highest staff costs and the lowest productivity,”

After more than eight months, IKEA management and Teamsters still butting heads | Human Resources | Business in Vancouver
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:07 AM   #106
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That's what happens in Union environments where everyone feels entitled and secure
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:48 AM   #107
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That's what happens in Union environments where everyone feels entitled and secure
I agree.

If you are a good worker, your job is secure and your pay will increase and you will move up through the company.

All unions do is help the weak, useless workers.

They equalize everyone doing a given task or job, when clearly not everyone is equal, there are always those who don't work hard, or they dog fuck, or w/e it may be. Unions protect these useless fucking people and put them on a level field with the productive workers and those who truly work hard. That takes away the incentive for the hard workers to work hard and in turn makes them a part of those useless fucking idiots.

And then to top it all off because their unionized its almost impossible to fire their asses because you'll get yourself in hot water really fast.
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Old 05-16-2014, 11:29 AM   #108
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The corporate worker drone is so disposable

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Old 05-16-2014, 12:41 PM   #109
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I agree.
not to mention the bureaucratic nature of a union benefits the union leaders the most. "Pay us to keep your jobs safe and secure, but not too safe or secure or else we'd be useless"
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Old 05-16-2014, 12:49 PM   #110
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BC Ferries employees are the most incompetent, lazy fuckers

UNIONIZED

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Old 05-16-2014, 01:11 PM   #111
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BC Ferries employees are the most incompetent, lazy fuckers

UNIONIZED

haha
But they're all highly trained and should there ever be an accident on the boat and it's sinking they'll put the lives of the passengers ahead of their own......... Totally justified.
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:18 PM   #112
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BC Ferries employees are the most incompetent, lazy fuckers

UNIONIZED

haha
I agree with you on that as well. ENGAGE RANT MODE:

BC ferries as an organization is broken altogether. Right from the senior management all the way on down to the people who direct traffic at the terminals, it's straight fucked up.

They have a monopoly on the entire system, and they still hemorrhage money. Its utterly ridiculous. They pay their senior management ridiculous salaries then they claim it's because to be competitive and efficient they "need to attract the best minds and leaders".

If you have a monopoly who exactly are you trying to compete with?

And your brilliant leaders must be doing a pretty shit job if its almost worth it for me to fly out to victoria instead of catch the ferry.

BC ferries needs to be dismantled as an organization and the ferry system should be sold off to someone for privatization. The government is obviously retarded at operating the system.

Then people have the audacity to cite saltspring and the texada and those little tiny islands as a reason not to privatize the ferry saying that service to those islands will suffer. You know what, GOOD, because for far too long the rest of BC has been subsidizing the ferry rides for those unemployed dickheads that choose to live on some stupid tiny fucking island. If you want to be sheltered from the rest of the province, fine thats your choice, but you can't then come and demand that we operate a ferry 10 times a day just so that when you need to come back to reality its still convenient.

/Rant

TL;DR - Fuck those island folk, privatize the ferries, I want my fucking tax dollars to go towards something useful.
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:24 PM   #113
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BC ferries as an organization is broken altogether.

When I went to Tofino the woman who was supposed to open the gate when we were docking was picking her nose and someone had to go get her to open the gate! She was standing right there, I have no idea why she didn't clue in.

Also on the way back, one of the deck workers walked by my rental car and the zipper on his jacket clipped the side mirror of my rental car. It left a little nick on the paint but luckily Budget didn't nail me for it.
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:40 PM   #114
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I agree with you on that as well. ENGAGE RANT MODE:
Excellent rant on the whole, but I wanted to point out one little disconnect:

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They pay their senior management ridiculous salaries then they claim it's because to be competitive and efficient they "need to attract the best minds and leaders".

If you have a monopoly who exactly are you trying to compete with?
You're confusing two different things: Ferries may have a monopoly on the water routes, but not on someone to run it, so while they don't have to "compete" with other transport for passengers, they do have to compete with other employers for head honchos.

Hahn left because he got a better offer. Everyone whined that he was making too much and said he should get half as much, so the next guy came in at half the price... and now people whine that he's making too much. No doubt he'll get a better offer at some point, and BCF will find someone else that will take even less... and yet again, nobody will think he's making too much.

I suggest BCF find someone who'll run the whole show for minimum wage... and just see how long it takes for things to REALLY go in the shitter. They'll all be longing for the great old days under David Hahn.

When you pay peanuts... you get monkeys.
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Old 05-16-2014, 01:49 PM   #115
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If BC Ferries didn't seem like it was run by monkeys, I think people would be ok with paying more than peanuts
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Old 05-16-2014, 02:16 PM   #116
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Excellent rant on the whole, but I wanted to point out one little disconnect:


You're confusing two different things: Ferries may have a monopoly on the water routes, but not on someone to run it, so while they don't have to "compete" with other transport for passengers, they do have to compete with other employers for head honchos.

Hahn left because he got a better offer. Everyone whined that he was making too much and said he should get half as much, so the next guy came in at half the price... and now people whine that he's making too much. No doubt he'll get a better offer at some point, and BCF will find someone else that will take even less... and yet again, nobody will think he's making too much.

I suggest BCF find someone who'll run the whole show for minimum wage... and just see how long it takes for things to REALLY go in the shitter. They'll all be longing for the great old days under David Hahn.

When you pay peanuts... you get monkeys.
That's fair I understand that they are competing for good managers and leaders, but for years they have been paying what I would consider high wages and the company is still operating like a massive piece of shit.

So obviously there is other problems. Personally I think that it is impossible for BC ferries to recover, and I don't believe the government is capable of running the ferries competently even if it did. You have to cut your losses somewhere and I vote here and now it should be done.

Just so I'd like to point out, that I don't give a crap that the fares are high, what I do care is that given how high the fares are you would think that the ferries could operate and atleast not lose money, but no, the ferries continue to operate at a net loss year after fucking year.

Also fine you need to pay your leaders hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. Why does the cashier at the toll booth make 25 bucks an hour. My local gas station cashier is miles busier, and he only makes 12 bucks an hour.
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Old 05-16-2014, 02:23 PM   #117
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That's fair I understand that they are competing for good managers and leaders, but for years they have been paying what I would consider high wages and the company is still operating like a massive piece of shit.

So obviously there is other problems. Personally I think that it is impossible for BC ferries to recover, and I don't believe the government is capable of running the ferries competently even if it did. You have to cut your losses somewhere and I vote here and now it should be done.
You obviously weren't around in the pre-privatized era of BC Ferries when things were REALLY a mess. Think it's bad now? This is nothing compared to when the government was running it all.
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Old 05-16-2014, 02:30 PM   #118
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You obviously weren't around in the pre-privatized era of BC Ferries when things were REALLY a mess. Think it's bad now? This is nothing compared to when the government was running it all.
I was around, but I was just younger and didn't care. So I can only imagine....

What I am curious about is the way its is organized now, how would they even divide up the company? I wonder if the management firm would be interested in buying it out.

TBH i'm kinda lost on how BCF is currently setup, I understand its solely owned by the government, so does that mean that the american company is just managing the service on their behalf?
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Old 05-16-2014, 02:33 PM   #119
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What I will point out, is that how this all relates to the OP and the original issue of this thread is this:

Frankly nobody gives a fuck about the Ikea in Richmond.

Even the ridiculously boring Ferry issue is more interesting then the original issue.
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Old 05-16-2014, 03:15 PM   #120
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After a year, I still can't get my 1 dollar fro-yo.
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Old 05-16-2014, 10:33 PM   #121
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But they're all highly trained and should there ever be an accident on the boat and it's sinking they'll put the lives of the passengers ahead of their own......... Totally justified.
Well you can't be 100% certain that would be the case. I'm confident they would, but if you look at the chicken shit captains of the cruise ship and ferry in Korea, it could happen that they gtfo first.
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Old 05-16-2014, 11:47 PM   #122
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Well you can't be 100% certain that would be the case. I'm confident they would, but if you look at the chicken shit captains of the cruise ship and ferry in Korea, it could happen that they gtfo first.
Lol, the smiley face didn't work where is the sarcasm emote.
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Old 05-17-2014, 08:27 AM   #123
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First off, where I work, I am a part of a Union.

Unions are suppose to provide a safe work environment and fair wages. Now that is said, take it with a grain of salt. What is deemed a fair wage is between Union and Employer.

It is always great when there is a new agreement and employees gets raises but give it a year or two, these wages are considered shit again by the employees just because other Unions have better deals. The Union will never work for everybody.

I understand that this Union at IKEA only have 35 employees. It is not a big number at all so the Union's leverage might not be high at all. But it is still the duty of the Union to provide fair wages.

What I don't understand is why is only Richmond's IKEA unionized and not the others. If they unionized across the board, things would have been more different.

Unions have pros and cons just like non-unionized have pros and cons. To out right slander Unions is not right in my books. Trust me, I am not biased here. I see the pros and cons of each side. But I firmly believe being in a Union is a great thing.
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Old 05-17-2014, 08:51 AM   #124
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I agree, I'm in a union too and most of the time I hate it for reasons Meme405 has already pointed out (though it's hard to look past his generalization of union workers all being lazy, but I get that he's just trying to make his point and qualified it by saying unions prevent hard workers from getting rewarded which is very, very true) and, in general, my employer is not full of a bunch of demon-minded power-hungry anti-christs who want to lay waste to all below them so the union isn't as necessary as it could be in another place... but there are times where people get picked on or maybe a manager is overextending someone's duties and they aren't getting compensated for it (and never will) and in that case it is something that people can fall back on to continue doing something they love to do even if someone above them is making the atmosphere inhospitable wherein if they were in a private company they would just be forced to quit and start over.

It's also nice to know that, at least in our organization, the "CEO" doesn't make 10,000 times more than you, he makes a reasonable wage and if there are tough times financially, they can't just use the "We gotta lay people off" approach as a knee-jerk reaction only to hire cheaper people back a year later when things are slightly rosier.
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Old 05-17-2014, 09:43 AM   #125
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I agree.

If you are a good worker, your job is secure and your pay will increase and you will move up through the company.

All unions do is help the weak, useless workers.

They equalize everyone doing a given task or job, when clearly not everyone is equal, there are always those who don't work hard, or they dog fuck, or w/e it may be. Unions protect these useless fucking people and put them on a level field with the productive workers and those who truly work hard. That takes away the incentive for the hard workers to work hard and in turn makes them a part of those useless fucking idiots.

And then to top it all off because their unionized its almost impossible to fire their asses because you'll get yourself in hot water really fast.
If you're lazy and incompetent, I don't know of many places where you'll be on a level playing field with those who work hard and are competent at their jobs, union or not. Certainly none of the places where I've worked.
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