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Old 07-12-2013, 04:41 PM   #76
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That's not their fucking name, hahaha damn
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Old 07-12-2013, 04:43 PM   #77
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That is some good trolling
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Old 07-12-2013, 05:07 PM   #78
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What kind of moron news channel would report something like that!

Great, watch the reporter go commit suicide now...
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Old 07-12-2013, 05:25 PM   #79
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Bahahahahah, epic news room troll
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Old 07-12-2013, 05:51 PM   #80
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All hail the mighty teleprompter!
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Old 07-12-2013, 10:54 PM   #81
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someone's gonna get a hurting reaaaaal bad
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Old 07-12-2013, 11:29 PM   #82
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Here's their apology

KTVU Apology for Friday Noon report | www.ktvu.com

And the NTSB apology

Press Release July 12, 2013

Apparently it was a "summer intern"
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Old 07-12-2013, 11:31 PM   #83
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BTW not to bump my own post, but if you skipped it you should really take a minute to read it. I know it's "wordy" and technical but it is worth seeing. It gives a glimpse into the model of learning that is done in Asia, and how it can relate to real world performance.

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One of the first things I learned was that the pilots kept a web-site and reported on every training session. ... a database was building on me (and everyone else) that told them exactly how I ran the sessions, what to expect on checks, and what to look out for.

..

I used to open an aft cargo door at 100 knots to get them to initiate an RTO ... This was on the B-737 NG and many of the captains were coming off the 777 or B744 and they were used to the Master Caution System being inhibited at 80 kts ... Well, for the first few days after I started that, EVERYONE rejected the takeoff. Then, all of a sudden they all “got it” and continued the takeoff (in accordance with their manuals). The word had gotten out. I figured it was an overall PLUS for the training program.
It goes on from there. Totally interesting blog
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Old 07-12-2013, 11:47 PM   #84
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I want to buy that summer intern a beer.
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Old 07-12-2013, 11:52 PM   #85
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Old 07-13-2013, 12:49 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by MoBettah View Post
Yes, Gladwell also says they've fixed that problem for the past 20 years and are among the best airlines to fly now.

People are seriously going to blame Korean culture for bringing down this plane? Fucking ridiculous.

The fallacy of blaming Korean ?culture? for Asiana crash - Bob King and Adam Snider - POLITICO.com

Read Outliers? I guess you're airplane crash expert.
No where did I blame it on the korean culture. Read the post again. I was just thinking about this and how it was a coincidence that it was a korean airline, and how it reminded me of gladwell's discussing korean airlines higher accident rates due to their culture.

no where in my post did I claim to be an airline pilot expert.
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Old 07-13-2013, 02:53 PM   #87
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I guess Bill Maher won't ever fly commercial to and from Asia.


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Originally Posted by Bill Maher
If future historians need to know how humans could ruin their planet out of pure selfish greed, they just have to look at this picture of people who won't get off a burning plane without their luggage.

Last edited by godwin; 07-13-2013 at 02:59 PM.
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Old 07-13-2013, 03:21 PM   #88
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Very well done pair of blog posts by a guy who goes by the name of The Korean;

Post one: Culturalism, Gladwell, and Airplane Crashes
Spoiler!


Article two:
Culturalism and Plane Crashes: Reactions
Spoiler!


TL;DR: Why is it that Asian cultures get blamed, but not French ones for French plane crashes, or American/British culture for oil spills? Srsly, what the fuck.
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Old 07-13-2013, 06:26 PM   #89
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lol at KTVU

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Old 07-13-2013, 09:34 PM   #90
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That's crazy. If he were another 10 ft lower, his tail would've touched the water. I can't imagine what would've happened if it touched the water and slowed the plane right down, and instead of the tail hitting the wall, the main fuselage hit the wall.
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Old 07-20-2013, 01:26 AM   #91
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Were Asiana Pilots Caught In The FLCH ?Trap??

Were Asiana Pilots Caught In The FLCH ‘Trap’?
By John Croft, Guy Norris
Source: Aviation Week & Space Technology

July 22, 2013
Credit: Australian Transport Safety Board
Highly experienced Boeing widebody pilots have independently determined that an autoflight mode called Flight Level Change may explain why Asiana Flight 214 hit the sea wall ahead of Runway 28L at San Francisco International Airport July 6.

The experts, including a Boeing 777 fleet captain, tell Aviation Week that entry into Flight Level Change (FLCH) during the approach would have caused the engines to remain at idle despite the pilots having set the autothrottles to maintain 137 kt., the target approach speed. One group of pilots has concluded this based on intimate knowledge of the 777-200ER's automation systems; the other by flying scenarios in a 777 simulator

Their analyses draw in large part on information presented in four NTSB briefings after the crash from pilot interviews and the cockpit voice and flight data recorders.

The NTSB revealed that the pilots were initially high and fast on the approach but rapidly decreased speed and altitude to intercept a visual glideslope to the runway. At 500 ft. altitude, the right-seat instructor pilot said he saw three red and one white precision approach path indicator (PAPI) lights—a set of four lights located near the intended landing markers that give pilots a visual glideslope—and realized he was slightly low. His speed, at 134 kt., was close to the 137 kt. target speed.

By 200 ft., however, the same pilot said he saw four red PAPI lights (significantly below glideslope) and noticed speed was nearing stall. At that point, he realized the autothrottles had not been keeping up. By the time the pilots added power, the aircraft was too low and slow, and in its high drag state could not climb fast enough to avoid striking the sea wall with its main gear and tail.

The NTSB says the engines and flight controls were responding correctly to inputs and there were no anomalies noted in the autopilot, flight director or autothrottle systems. Switches in the cockpit showed that the left and right autothrottles were “armed,” and the flight director was “on” for the right-seat and “off” for the left-seat pilot, who was at the controls for the landing. Experts say it is not unusual for a pilot to turn the flight director off on a visual approach to reduce clutter or confusing data on the primary flight display.

Based on the NTSB's forensic data, automation decisions earlier in the approach appear to be reasonable: Descending through 4,000 ft., the right-seat pilot said the aircraft was “slightly high” and he used the aircraft's vertical-speed mode to descend at 1,500 ft. per min. with the autopilot controlling. The left and right autothrottles were “armed,” and he correctly assumed the automation system would have controlled the speed to 137 kt. Pilots use the master control panel (MCP) at the top center of the 777's panel to select autonomy modes and input heading, altitude, speed and vertical-speed commands for the autopilot and autothrottle systems.

The 777 experts verified that the pilot's assumptions were reasonable in that respect—the vertical-speed mode uses pitch to control rate of climb or descent, and throttles, via the autothrottle system, to maintain speed. In the simulator, they found that even with the autothrottles “armed” but turned off, the vertical-speed mode would not allow the aircraft's speed to decay a significant amount before autothrottles “woke up” and maintained the preset speed. Boeing recommends setting the minimum descent altitude for non-instrument approaches in the MCP altitude window to ensure the aircraft levels off and maintains speed, though some airlines will set “0 ft.” in the altitude window, the experts say.

Closer to the runway, the mode control decisions are not clear. The NTSB says that during the final 2.5 min. of the flight, “multiple autopilot modes and multiple autothrottle modes” were commanded, according to the flight data recorder. During that time frame, the aircraft was descending at approximately 180 kt. through 2,000 ft. on a straight-in visual approach to 28L. At 1,600 ft., the NTSB says the pilots disconnected the autopilot, presumably to hand-fly the approach with the 137-kt. target speed entered into the “indicated airspeed” field on the MCP.

The 777 experts say the most plausible explanation for what happened next was that the pilots, intentionally or in error, selected the FLCH mode on the MCP with the target altitude set at 0 ft. or the minimum descent altitude. In a descent, FLCH reduces thrust to flight idle. The throttles will typically reengage when the aircraft reaches an altitude selected on the MCP, or if the aircraft's speed nears stall speed at radio altimeter heights greater than 100 ft. If the altitude was selected to zero, however, the throttles would have remained at flight idle as Flight 214's pilots increased pitch to remain on the glideslope, causing airspeed to drop below preset levels.

“Boeing is aware of this shortcoming, which in some circles is known as the FLCH 'trap,' and in its training course demonstrates the danger to pilots,” says one of the 777 experts. “The danger of the FLCH trap is that if the autopilot is disengaged and the aircraft levels off early . . . or the rate of descent is reduced, then the airspeed will decay because the autothrottle is temporarily out of the loop.”


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Old 07-21-2013, 08:12 AM   #92
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I don't know why my fail button is missing in some of the responses, but remember this:

There is absolutely nothing in your goddamn luggage worth putting yourself, or the lives of other in jeopardy. It doesn't matter if your entire business or livelihood is in that suitcase.

You can start over. Dead people can't.
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Old 07-21-2013, 10:40 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Psykopathik View Post
I don't know why my fail button is missing in some of the responses, but remember this:

There is absolutely nothing in your goddamn luggage worth putting yourself, or the lives of other in jeopardy. It doesn't matter if your entire business or livelihood is in that suitcase.

You can start over. Dead people can't.
Yes Mr. Idealistic.

The truth is, people are driven by greed & selfishness in those times of extreme panic and chaos. You will likely see people willing to step on children if it meant that it could save their own life and their families.

I'm not saying that it's right, but you have to be realistic.
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Old 07-22-2013, 10:15 AM   #94
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Yes Mr. Idealistic.

The truth is, people are driven by greed & selfishness in those times of extreme panic and chaos. You will likely see people willing to step on children if it meant that it could save their own life and their families.

I'm not saying that it's right, but you have to be realistic.
we'll I'd be the first to shove them out of my way with my foot.

trampling other people in a panic is one thing. stopping to grab luggage is another.

idealistic yes.
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