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Vancouver Off-Topic / Current Events The off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.

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Old 08-20-2013, 11:58 AM   #26
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Just saw it this morning, quite sad
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Old 08-20-2013, 12:39 PM   #27
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Meh. Freedom of speech. No actual crime here.
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I'm no legal expert but just searching hate crime Canada I get this.

Sections 318, 319, and 320 of the Code forbid hate propaganda.[4] "Hate propaganda" means "any writing, sign or visible representation that advocates or promotes genocide or the communication of which by any person would constitute an offence under section 319."

It might fall under that? I think the problem with that legislation is it's more to deal with race, ethnic origin and sex I'm not sure how it would apply to someone who's mentally ill.
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Old 08-20-2013, 12:48 PM   #28
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I feel worse for the kids of the mother that wrote that letter. Can you imagine having to grow up with a mother like that? This is how serial killers happen.
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Old 08-20-2013, 01:15 PM   #29
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If the person who wrote it was ever ousted whatever happens in public would be far worse than any sort of hate crime charge they would be handed
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Old 08-20-2013, 01:31 PM   #30
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I'm no legal expert but just searching hate crime Canada I get this.

Sections 318, 319, and 320 of the Code forbid hate propaganda.[4] "Hate propaganda" means "any writing, sign or visible representation that advocates or promotes genocide or the communication of which by any person would constitute an offence under section 319."

It might fall under that? I think the problem with that legislation is it's more to deal with race, ethnic origin and sex I'm not sure how it would apply to someone who's mentally ill.
The goals of the laws are to protect against the mass communication of hate speech.

Mass.

As in trying to incite hate of others and having to listen to your group of people being hated.

I don't want to live in the country where this letter gets the author into trouble with hate speech. A government tribunal sits and determines how bad your opinion really is? No thanks.
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:08 PM   #31
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I don't want to live in the country where this letter gets the author into trouble with hate speech. A government tribunal sits and determines how bad your opinion really is? No thanks.
What do you suppose should happen to the author of the letter, Grid? Should the police investigate? And if they find out who it is, how should the community react to it?

The community rallying behind the grandmother with the autistic kid is probably enough to send the message out that this kind of behaviour is not welcomed, and the perpetrator would probably be smart enough to shut up. But a part of me would really like to see the perpetrator being identified.
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:15 PM   #32
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Press release states not a hate crime

Anyway, this person lives in close proximity to the victims family so I think sooner or later their community should be able to figure out who wrote it and hopefully run that bitch out of town
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:17 PM   #33
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gather up some of the autistic kids friends and have them play outside every day from 7am - 11pm. push the lady over the edge to the point where she just comes bursting out the door screaming and have everyone find out who she is.

the kid isn't perfect, what can you do. put a muzzle on him and a straight jacket and push him around on a wheelchair outside for exercise?? the person is autistic, you should be thankful that your not and you don't have to have a family who knows how hard it is to deal with the person. its easy to say you'd tell the person to get control of their kid, but if you were the one in control of the kid and someone told you, im pretty sure you'd rip around digging into the person explaining the difficulties.

in gridlocks example where he asked the lady to take a different route, honestly, id hope people just stand there and would laugh at your request. if someone had the audacity to ask me even in the most politest way to please take a different route with my kid because he was autistic/special needs and loud, id just shrug it off and continue with the same route everyday. in those cases, sadly I hope that they or someone they know will have to experience what its like, just so they can get a different perspective on things.

2 houses over from me is a girl, shes 18 years old, and autistic. ive seen her since she was born. is she annoying at times? of course. is she loud? a bit. but I would never expect or want someone to ask them to move or to take her elsewhere to play instead of her own back yard. if they were to ask, id just stand there and turn my back on them and go back to playing with the kid.
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:39 PM   #34
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Here's my deal...if I need to be respectful of your thing, you can equally be respectful of mine. We can meet halfway. Wanna have a loud party on Friday night? Shut the fuck up Saturday. Wanna have a kid bark every day? Fine. Keep him off my lawn(s).
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:42 PM   #35
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What do you suppose should happen to the author of the letter, Grid? Should the police investigate? And if they find out who it is, how should the community react to it?

The community rallying behind the grandmother with the autistic kid is probably enough to send the message out that this kind of behaviour is not welcomed, and the perpetrator would probably be smart enough to shut up. But a part of me would really like to see the perpetrator being identified.
Super easy...is there a threat either real or implied in the letter?

Then investigate that threat. Otherwise? However inappropriate, its up to the receiver to deal with their correspondence as they see fit.

If we jump to a hate crime everytime some douchecanoe mouths off, then we suddenly live in a very different country.
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Old 08-20-2013, 02:59 PM   #36
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Here's my deal...if I need to be respectful of your thing, you can equally be respectful of mine. We can meet halfway. Wanna have a loud party on Friday night? Shut the fuck up Saturday. Wanna have a kid bark every day? Fine. Keep him off my lawn(s).
what if the lawn is on a condo? so its a shared lawn? would they have just as much right to be there as any other paying tenant?

(im assuming you or dino would know since she does the building management thing so im guessing you guys would know strata rules)
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Old 08-20-2013, 03:06 PM   #37
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what if the lawn is on a condo? so its a shared lawn? would they have just as much right to be there as any other paying tenant?

(im assuming you or dino would know since she does the building management thing so im guessing you guys would know strata rules)
Total tangent on this issue...but no.

Just because we rent out apartments doesn't make the front lawn a park. I put in my own time on the lawn and gardens for my own personal benefit( I enjoy gardening) and for the benefit of the people that rent our apartments.

Some kid whacking at shit with a stick is just a piss off, pure and simple.

Now, back on target..I can yell and swear from my roof top throne every day when I see them like a raving loony(I'd fit it actually) OR we can come to a mutually acceptable compromise.

She seemed to think that my compromise was acceptable.
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Old 08-20-2013, 06:20 PM   #38
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Just to add, Autism is a spectrum disability where you can range from very high functioning to being completely dependent on others.

People who are interested should also look up Asperger's syndrome which is very similar to that of highly functioning Autism.
Aspergers has been removed from the DSM-V

I also like to call it neckbeard syndrome.
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Old 08-20-2013, 06:57 PM   #39
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I saw that letter on reddit and was 100% sure it was made up just to get up votes. Wow, that is truly a disgusting person.

That being said, if you have a kid who is disturbing the peace, efforts need to be taken to prevent that. If the kid walks around screaming out in public, ignoring him while he boers others is wrong. If he needs to bbe secluded or put somewhere that he doesn't ruins others' lives, that's totally fair.
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Old 08-20-2013, 07:23 PM   #40
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I could understand noise pollution frustrations. I can understand feeling very overwhelmed, but why not go and talk to them. The grandmother is not autistic, perhaps just asking her if she could not put the child outside for long periods of time due to the noise.
Perhaps offer other alternatives such as go for a walk, got to the park, or being a caring human being and try talking to the child. There autistic but they are still human. Compassion and love, every living thing needs this, so take that frustration and put it towards something useful. Help out rather than lash out.
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Old 08-20-2013, 08:39 PM   #41
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The letter is nasty but it isn't criminal.

My neighbor's kid is autistic and is fully dependent on others for his care. He makes loud noises when he's outside. Yes, it is quite distracting but thankfully the family takes him out for walks around the block with their dog so the noise is only momentary.
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Old 08-20-2013, 08:59 PM   #42
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what makes it worse is the mother has torrets or somthing as well which is why he's with the grandparents most of the time because the mother is in a wheel chair :/

shitty situation all around but in alot of ways it kinda makes my head spin that stories like this can get so big
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:37 PM   #43
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what makes it worse is the mother has torrets or somthing as well which is why he's with the grandparents most of the time because the mother is in a wheel chair :/

shitty situation all around but in alot of ways it kinda makes my head spin that stories like this can get so big
the mom has Multiple Sclerosis
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Old 08-20-2013, 10:50 PM   #44
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Aspergers has been removed from the DSM-V

I also like to call it neckbeard syndrome.
It wasn't removed from the DSM-V. It was incorporated into the Autism spectrum. I had mentioned how it was highly similar so it is not all that surprising.
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Old 08-20-2013, 11:52 PM   #45
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Super easy...is there a threat either real or implied in the letter?

Then investigate that threat. Otherwise? However inappropriate, its up to the receiver to deal with their correspondence as they see fit.

If we jump to a hate crime everytime some douchecanoe mouths off, then we suddenly live in a very different country.
Is there a real or implied threat in the letter? I guess it depends on how the grandmother (or parents) read it. Personally, if I were a family member of the autistic kid, I would feel scared for the safety and well being of my autistic family member, because I obviously know there is this person out there in my community that has an overt bias against him. More importantly, because this person suggested euthanasia for my autistic family member, I think I have every valid reason to fear that this insane person might just try precisely what he is suggesting to my family member. For me at least, the euthanasia suggestion has clearly crossed the line.

The police would probably be able to lay any actual charges on the person, but if I were a member of the community, I think I would want to know, and I think I'd have a right to know, who this crazy person is.
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Old 08-20-2013, 11:57 PM   #46
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I'm curious what exactly kind of sounds do autistic children make that horrifies people? Is it a scream?
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Old 08-21-2013, 12:31 AM   #47
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Do we have to assign a pathology to everything that is bad in this world? That's the reason why we are so medicated!

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I have done a lot of work/volunteering with children and adults with autism, I also have a foster child with autism.

First, individuals with developmental disabilities don't have 'handlers', they have support staff, family members, friends and volunteers who work passionately to help improve the quality of life for them.

The letter itself is brutal, but I suspect the author has his/her own mental health issues..so it doesn't really make me angry..more I feel sorry for the writer that he or she has these internal issues going on that manifested as hate towards the poor boy and his grandmother.
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:09 AM   #48
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I'm curious what exactly kind of sounds do autistic children make that horrifies people? Is it a scream?
In my case, the kid barked. As in,

"ahhh, argh, argh," as loud as he could as he walked up and down the road. Constant, non-stop, and he would stop and do it at people, and try to scare them with it if he saw them in a parkade.

No it was cool. Should just appreciate all god's creatures.
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:11 AM   #49
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Is there a real or implied threat in the letter? I guess it depends on how the grandmother (or parents) read it. Personally, if I were a family member of the autistic kid, I would feel scared for the safety and well being of my autistic family member, because I obviously know there is this person out there in my community that has an overt bias against him. More importantly, because this person suggested euthanasia for my autistic family member, I think I have every valid reason to fear that this insane person might just try precisely what he is suggesting to my family member. For me at least, the euthanasia suggestion has clearly crossed the line.

The police would probably be able to lay any actual charges on the person, but if I were a member of the community, I think I would want to know, and I think I'd have a right to know, who this crazy person is.
Oh shit buddy. There are threats all over.

A threat would be "I want to euthanize the kid" or "I'm going to euthanize the kid"

My Canada pet peeve is we expect so much protection from government and authority but forget it comes at a cost.

"Omg its hate mail..do something!"
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Old 08-21-2013, 09:30 AM   #50
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A threat would be "I want to euthanize the kid" or "I'm going to euthanize the kid"
Buddy, what you mentioned above would be a direct open threat that would 1000% get police investigation going, and probably charges laid if the person is found. The way euthanasia is mentioned in the letter would be an implied threat.
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