Canadian politics thread

[whitev70r]

Originally Posted by Traum

IMO it is also absolutely true that the Chinese gov is providing direct and heavy subsidies to Chinese (EV) manufacturers that continues to contribute to their overproduction capacity. And China is desparately trying to offload those overproduced goods to the international market. This is an unfair business practice, so pushing back against that in one form or another is entirely reasonable. That said, it could be done in a number of different ways instead of outright banning China-made EVs. (Tariffs could be one tool to use against this.)

If PRC wants to subsidize my EV vehicle, I'm fine with it. I mean, I get more upset that Canadian gov't subsidizes high income earners (generally who can afford EV's) rebates for NA or Korean EV's. Isn't Polestar Chinese now?

[Hondaracer]

Let the govt. choose who the bad guy is for you.

The stupid cars are made in side by side factories, Elon is the good guy though and he’ll charge you double what the neighboring factory does.

[whitev70r]

Not sure if it is politics related but it can be if Government orders Air Canada back to work (should the attendants go on strike, this Saturday), at the height of travelling season. Watch AC stock dive.

So just hearing some clips here and there ... WTF is with AC? They have this stupid ancient policy where flight attendants don't get paid until the wheels of the plane move. So all that safety checks & stuff, they don't get paid for that time prepping the plane and all.

I'm with the flight attendants on this one. Is this like common policy on all airlines, same for Westjet? I mean if I was an attendant, I'd work for BA, Cathay, Lufthansa ... anything but AC!

[Jason00S2000]

EVs are gay.

[bcrdukes]

AC for life!

[CivicBlues]

Originally Posted by whitev70r

Not sure if it is politics related but it can be if Government orders Air Canada back to work (should the attendants go on strike, this Saturday), at the height of travelling season. Watch AC stock dive.

So just hearing some clips here and there ... WTF is with AC? They have this stupid ancient policy where flight attendants don't get paid until the wheels of the plane move. So all that safety checks & stuff, they don't get paid for that time prepping the plane and all.

I'm with the flight attendants on this one. Is this like common policy on all airlines, same for Westjet? I mean if I was an attendant, I'd work for BA, Cathay, Lufthansa ... anything but AC!

I don't think it's just AC doing this. It's "Industry Standard" according to the news.

[Hondaracer]

Yea.. it’s the industry standard, which they agreed upon in the last collective bargaining agreement

So when you dig into it it isn’t really this shocking revelation like the union makes it out to be. Does it make sense to not pay until the doors are closed? Probably not. But that’s how the industry works and that’s the norm in aviation.

Typical Canadian union BS just going to raise the price for the consumer

[mikemhg]

It is kind of crazy they don't get paid during that time, here's a crazy statistic.

Flight attendants do not get paid for roughly 35 hours of work they do in a week, before take off and after landing.

That's a pretty wild stat.

AA went through the same dispute last year:

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/12/12275...irlines-strike

[6793026]

i got a flighjt 1st week of Sept.. see if i can cancel and pivot to poorter..

[mikemhg]

We have a flight to Phoenix on September 11th (my favorite day to fly) for a Chris Brown concert on Air Canada.

I don't think the strike will go that long, that'll be an absolute disaster for AC, not worried about it.

[6793026]

Originally Posted by mikemhg

It is kind of crazy they don't get paid during that time, here's a crazy statistic.

Flight attendants do not get paid for roughly 35 hours of work they do in a week, before take off and after landing.

That's a pretty wild stat.

AA went through the same dispute last year:

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/12/12275...irlines-strike

errrrr there are so many hours of stuff at work that I do that's not within the 40 hours.
WHat about teachers ... etc..
It's however you spin it. I wonder what the globalk standards are; there must be justification. (eg/ Cathay etc..).

Heck.. u can get paid WAY more for those hours ON the flights but nothing on the ground. They also fall under different rules I guess.

[bcrdukes]

Originally Posted by mikemhg

We have a flight to Phoenix on September 11th (my favorite day to fly) for a Chris Brown concert on Air Canada.

I don't think the strike will go that long, that'll be an absolute disaster for AC, not worried about it.

I may be confused with another artist but didn't you just see Chris brown in Seattle or something?

[Traum]

Originally Posted by SkinnyPupp

How do these subsidies compare to American companies?

It is not easy to come up with a direct comparison between Chinese gov subsidies for the EV manufacturing sector (including for batteries) and what American companies receive. Some of the figures from the mid to late 2010's seem to suggest that China provided ~5x the gov subsidies to the EV manufacturing sector than the US. But the overall amount of subsidies the Chinese EV sector received has also increased another 2 - 2.5x from the mid 2010's to early 2020's.

You're based in HK, so you should be at least somewhat familiar with the vast selection of different EV brands available to the Chinese market. This is no conincidence because both the central and local govs in China are very aggressively pushing for both the growth and adoption of China-made EVs, and to phase out ICE (for the average consumer). At one point, I remeber there were registration and usage limits on new ICE vehicle purchases in major cities, but those don't exist for EVs. I don't remember the details, but it was something like you can't register a new ICE unless you are transfering the registration of an existing ICE vehicle to the new one. And something like only being able to drive on an even or odd date based on your licence plate number.

Originally Posted by whitev70r

If PRC wants to subsidize my EV vehicle, I'm fine with it. I mean, I get more upset that Canadian gov't subsidizes high income earners (generally who can afford EV's) rebates for NA or Korean EV's. Isn't Polestar Chinese now?

The problem with the Chinese gov subsidizing your EV doesn't occur at the consumer level. In fact as most of us can see, it is beneficial for consumers because of the lowered prices. But the problem occurs at the business and industrial level, and to a certain extent, at a national prosperity and security level.

Also, subsidies don't just occurs at the consumer level with purchase rebates. At the manufacturing level, a lot of gov help is also present. Those subsidies don't directly benefit us, but they make for very attractive incentives for manufacturers, and are almost certainly bigger on a per vehicle basis that what consumers get through EV purchase rebates.

The solar panel is a really good historical example of how Chinese subsidy has vastly benefited consumers while simultaneously killing the business and industrial sector in the Western world. At the time, Chinese gov subsidies were basically allowing Chinese solar panel manufacturers to massively undercut western companies, so a significant percentage of western solar panel manufacturing companies went bankrupt. (China now accounts for ~80% of all solar panel production in the world.) This is obviously bad for the solar panel sector in the western world. And bad news in the manufacturing sector would at least mean a hit to the economy.

Now, solar panel may not be that big of a deal as a national security issue. But let's say Alberta would somehow want to ditch its O&G sector and become a green energy powerhouse (haha~), the transition would be at the mercy of the Chinese gov because they can easily restrict the sale of solar panels to Alberta.

There is a lot of engineering and industrial expertise in building cars. If we lose that and simply farm the work out to China, then we'll be at their mercy for obtaining those goods. This would not be a problem if China were a friendly state like Japan or most EU countries. But China is not exactly a friendly state for us. (Even the current US administration is not exactly our friend right now.) So if we become over-reliant on them, it becomes a problem.

The ship building industry is another example of this. Remember how the new BCF new ship contracts went to some Chinese company with state ties? No Canadian companies submitted a bid simly bcos our own ship building sector is no longer competitive.

[mikemhg]

Originally Posted by bcrdukes

I may be confused with another artist but didn't you just see Chris brown in Seattle or something?

You got a good memory Dukes, I'm impressed.

Yes, we went to Chris Brown and 50 Cent in Seattle last year

I'll admit, I'm a fan of the guy, I only hit my women when they mess up my sandwich though.

[bcrdukes]

I know it's a ways out, but keep me posted on whether your flight materializes or not. I have a flight to Vancouver towards the end of September on AC. I'm not worried about it being cancelled or not.

I remember it because I recall CivicBlues calling you out on going to Seattle when you could have seen it in Vancouver, or something along those lines. And how does anyone forget Chris Brown for what he did?

[mikemhg]

Will do.

Man, even the woman involved (Rihanna) has forgiven him for whatever went down, if someone still has a problem, that's on them.

[whitev70r]

Has A$AP forgiven Chris Brown

[mikemhg]

Rocky is loaded now, he's sitting on a billion while injecting babies into his rich wife.

[blkgsr]

Originally Posted by mikemhg

It is kind of crazy they don't get paid during that time, here's a crazy statistic.

Flight attendants do not get paid for roughly 35 hours of work they do in a week, before take off and after landing.

That's a pretty wild stat.

AA went through the same dispute last year:

https://www.npr.org/2024/02/12/12275...irlines-strike

how is that mathematically possible??

if they don't get paid for 35 HOURS a week....how many hours are they getting paid for? 40? so they're "working" 75+ hours a week??

[68style]

My ex wife was a flight attendant, it was a long time ago but my memory of it was her doing like 1 long turn around to Shanghai or Beijing and then a couple short USA flights and then being off for like a week.

It didn’t seem like a very tough work/life balance schedule.

[mikemhg]

Originally Posted by blkgsr

how is that mathematically possible??

if they don't get paid for 35 HOURS a week....how many hours are they getting paid for? 40? so they're "working" 75+ hours a week??

It's all that downtime, it all adds up.

[whitev70r]

Originally Posted by 68style

It didn’t seem like a very tough work/life balance schedule.

It is if you have a family.

Yah, one long haul to Asia but then you got to stay a day or something, and then fly back. They must have some secret sauce to deal with the jetlag. I'm not suggesting AC pay full salary for the day (8 hrs) they have to stay in Shanghai or HK or whatever, but there should be some compensation other than nice hotel stay, meals, time for shopping spree, and partying with the pilot & crew.

[Hondaracer]

AC’s flight map is -nothing- compared to most carriers

I follow a few AC flight attendants on IG and for the most part they seem to fly the same routes over and over. The secret to jet lag is that they never change their time. You just always live on your local time

I also believe you’re not obligated to fly long-haul all the time. You can fly strictly domestic, but for less pay obviously

[blkgsr]

Originally Posted by mikemhg

It's all that downtime, it all adds up.

i can understand wanting to get paid while dealing with passengers boarding the plane. i don't think i've ever seen an actual flight attendant do the luggage check in or gate check, at least haven't paid enough attention apparently.

The second you're dealing with preflight or passengers i agree they should be paid. what more are they asking for?

[Traum]

Originally Posted by Hondaracer

I follow a few AC flight attendants on IG and for the most part they seem to fly the same routes over and over. The secret to jet lag is that they never change their time. You just always live on your local time

I also believe you’re not obligated to fly long-haul all the time. You can fly strictly domestic, but for less pay obviously

Takeaway #1 from Honda's post:
Honda is ogling a few AC flight attendants.

Takeaway #2:
I guess only flight hours are paid bcos the airlines need to have some sort of (monetary) incentives to entice more attendants to work in the long haul flights, since those are far more physically demanding?

Work is work, and work done should get paid. However, it seems to me that the whole pay structure for the flight attendance sector should get a major revamp. If the pre-flight work is deemed to be of an "easier" nature, pay that at a lower rate than the flight time rate. And if the airlines want to entice more staff to fill the long haul shifts? Pay more for long haul flights compared to short haul.

In my late 20's - early 30's when FB was still all the rage, I had a few friends who were flight attendants for CX and AC. They seem to fly the same routes most of the time too. But I only follow them on FB bcos we were actually friends.