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Vancouver Auto Chat 2016 VAC Community Head Moderator: Raid3n

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Old 05-30-2019, 06:48 AM   #101
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It’s actually not beneficial at all to give police the power to take away a person’s livelihood based on circumstantial evidence with no checks and balances.

This law is completely unnecessary. Impaired driving rates were already at historical lows when it was introduced, young drivers had the steepest declines in impaired driving rates (meaning overall impaired driving rates will decline at a steeper rate as young drivers replace older drivers), passive vehicle safety continues to improve, and active vehicle safety technology is becoming the norm.

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/.../14679-eng.htm

Well like I said, its the abuse you want to stop.

The people taken off the streets far surpasses the few bad stories you hear on the news. I think its far easier to deal with the few bad apples than to strip all powers for legitimate police work.

Sure the stats may be going down but that doesn't mean people aren't getting killed. There isn't enough officers to be on every block patrolling so when they get the call of a possible impaired driver they are able to act on that information. The general public that reports crime aren't usually doing it maliciously. In fact false police reports are actually a criminal offence.
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Old 05-30-2019, 08:56 AM   #102
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Abuse will continue and increase when there are no checks and balances and police can act as judge, jury, and prosecution. Look no further than the VI thread for what happens when you give the police unchecked authority to levy punishment without recourse.

This law runs contrary to the foundation upon which our justice system was founded on (presumption of innocence, right to a fair trial, etc.) and continues the erosion of a citizen’s rights in the name of “safety” for an issue that, as the stats show, was already at a historical low AND on the decline.
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Old 05-30-2019, 08:59 AM   #103
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People should be pro police powers, but anti-abuse of those powers.
lmao, thats the most naive shit i've ever read
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Old 05-30-2019, 09:26 AM   #104
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Well like I said, its the abuse you want to stop.

The people taken off the streets far surpasses the few bad stories you hear on the news. I think its far easier to deal with the few bad apples than to strip all powers for legitimate police work.
This is counter to one of our fundamental principles of law. It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer.
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Old 05-30-2019, 10:57 AM   #105
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So brutal. To hear these stories makes me not even want to drive anymore. It's not like there are stories about impaired younger persons getting behind the wheel and causing an accident. Middle aged woman with kids, 76 year old woman returning cans for deposit money, medical conditions preventing them from actually being able to blow properly; and they are treated like complete criminals, livelihoods ruined, out of pocket thousands defending themselves. This is beyond ridiculous. But hey, super safe roads now right?

I'd wager that distracted driving is a WAY larger factor in accidents compared to being impaired. The laws have done their job, especially over the last 10 - 20 years. Why step it up even further now? Doesn't make sense.
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Old 05-30-2019, 11:33 AM   #106
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The people taken off the streets far surpasses the few bad stories you hear on the news. I think its far easier to deal with the few bad apples than to strip all powers for legitimate police work.
Yeah it's all good and well until you're the one who's getting fucked over for no reason. I get the spirit of the law but I don't agree with the rights you are giving up to get there.

Basically if you've had a few drinks at your house just pretend you're not home if the cops knock on the door? Why risk it. Whats next, they get to bust down your door looking for you because someone at the restaurant reported that I was loaded and drove home?
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Old 05-30-2019, 02:42 PM   #107
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lmao, thats the most naive shit I've ever read
You'd think but reality is most officers have a brain and know that laws like these that get abused will be taken away.

Mistakes can be made in anything and so can abuse, that's why you want a strong appeal process, police complaints/oversight and a court system.
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Old 05-30-2019, 02:59 PM   #108
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You'd think but reality is most officers have a brain and know that laws like these that get abused will be taken away.

Mistakes can be made in anything and so can abuse, that's why you want a strong appeal process, police complaints/oversight and a court system.
So you're in favor of a system which allows the police to be judge and jury and it's up to the average citizen to take time out of their schedule, at great cost to themselves, to prove their innocence?

It shouldn't be going to appeal processes... A law which states I can get a DUI 2hrs after operating a motor vehicle, then deal with the immense cost of it, and then have to go to court and pay to prove my innocence; is fucked. Plain and simple.
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Old 05-31-2019, 05:12 AM   #109
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I'd wager that distracted driving is a WAY larger factor in accidents compared to being impaired. The laws have done their job, especially over the last 10 - 20 years. Why step it up even further now? Doesn't make sense.
Not sure on accidents, but when it comes to deaths in BC distracted driving is basically a non-issue compared to drunk driving. I don't have time to find it again, but if you look on the coroners website they publish reports on this sort of thing.
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Old 05-31-2019, 08:06 AM   #110
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Not sure on accidents, but when it comes to deaths in BC distracted driving is basically a non-issue compared to drunk driving. I don't have time to find it again, but if you look on the coroners website they publish reports on this sort of thing.
We don't need harsher impairment laws and police with more power to ruin my BBQ's.

88 deaths due to distracted driving in BC last year

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/t...g-consultation

More deaths in BC due to distracted driving than drinking and driving

https://www.icbc.com/about-icbc/news...017-Sept6.aspx
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Old 05-31-2019, 08:23 AM   #111
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The law was already egregious and featured assumption of guilt prior to this if you even slept in your car while drunk and had access to the keys... they assumed you had the intention to drive and you’re done. This was already an inherently unfair law in that regard before these changes.

This is next level and highly unnecessary.
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Old 05-31-2019, 08:54 AM   #112
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We don't need harsher impairment laws and police with more power to ruin my BBQ's.

88 deaths due to distracted driving in BC last year

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/t...g-consultation

More deaths in BC due to distracted driving than drinking and driving

https://www.icbc.com/about-icbc/news...017-Sept6.aspx
Oh please. Those numbers are absolute bull shit.

First, I'm on board with you about current drinking driving laws. I'm very against what they currently can do, but ICBC is misleading the public on the distracted driving issue.

Have you seen what they include?

**Police data from 2011 to 2015. Distraction: where one or more of the vehicles involved had contributing factors including use of communication/video equipment, driver inattentive and driver internal/external distraction.

This is the same kind of garbage they pull out when they try to demonize speeding. Driver inattention could be day dreaming, putting out a cig, arguing with the spouse/kids or getting a BJ (yes, this happens). They try and pretend like this is just a cell phone issue which is totally misleading.

Also, how easily can you really tell someone was being inattentive when assessing a crime scene?

30-40% of road deaths involve drugs or Alcohol. This is way way easier to verify, and more importantly rule out.

Source: https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/bi...i-incident.pdf

Drinking and driving is a much much larger issue, but that doesn't mean our rights should be tossed out the window when it comes to enforcement.
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Old 05-31-2019, 09:31 AM   #113
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My point is simply I don't agree with you that distracted driving is "basically a non-issue compared to drunk driving". The stats would say they are both relevant. If you want to interpret the stats are BS that is your choice but they are there. I personally would not argue distracted driving is a non issue in comparison or that "Drinking and driving is a much much larger issue"
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Old 05-31-2019, 09:51 AM   #114
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The changes to the criminal code don't serve to justify harassment of everyone and anyone, they serve to ensure that minor errors/mistakes in police notes and testimony relating the process by which defendants were pulled over and questioned don't result in not-guilty verdicts even though these defendants may have blown 2-3x over the legal limit.

Fixing holes in the legal system exploited by lawyers, it's not that the new laws are excessive, it's that the old law was faulty.
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Old 05-31-2019, 05:34 PM   #115
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^^^Honestly, i'm not well versed in the inner workings of the laws.. So i'm curious what loopholes are being closed with these new laws?
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