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03-24-2020, 06:08 AM
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#2601 | | Where's my RS Christmas Lobster?!
Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: New Chinatown
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Originally Posted by Manic!  Well how much is a human life worth? | Unfortunately, you can't apply Kantian ethics with limited resources. Not that any politicians actually think like that.
How about the life of someone who lost their jobs/got laid off due to shutdown? Do they not matter?
Shutdown is a short term solution where you are suspecting everyone simply because you don't know, but you can't do this forever as you need people to go out and spend money on things other than grocery to collect taxes and encourage the cash flow. It's like throwing everyone in the prison because there is a potential we can all be criminals.
I can only hope that we can get enough testing kits. At least that can help more accurately pinpoint who has the virus and who doesn't.
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03-24-2020, 06:15 AM
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#2602 | | what manner of phaggotry is this
Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Kelownafornia
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Originally Posted by Bouncing Bettys I do irrigation (construct, repair, service, etc) for a landscaping/ground maintenance company, doing mostly commercial and city contract work. It isn't really essential, yet social distancing has been very easy to do. My current project is a city park, one of the very places Dr. Henry encourages people to visit. These blanket rules for the lowest common denominator could put me out of work soon.
I guess with a loose interpretation it could fit under #13 or #28. If my boss really wanted to try and work around it, he could go with #71, since he keeps horses on the property. | I too own a landscaping and landscape maintenance company. 75% of our work is strata/commercial maintenance including irrigation maintenance. The other 25% is construction/installations.
Pretty confident at least the strata/commercial maintenance side is deemed essential by line #13 but we will know more when BC goes that route with a phone call. The construction side will surely be shut down tho.
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03-24-2020, 07:28 AM
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#2603 | | I subscribe to the Fight Club ONLY
Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: 604
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Originally Posted by UnknownJinX Unfortunately, you can't apply Kantian ethics with limited resources. Not that any politicians actually think like that. | Agreed, even in healthcare system alone, there are only so many test kits, only so many ventilators, only so many beds in a hospital. Who do you save? The ones with highest probability of survival? Then you have to think of patients outside of Covid19 pandemic, patients with existing conditions waiting for procedures. You have to make choices. It's Jonathan Mills consequentialism ethics time.
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03-24-2020, 07:56 AM
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#2604 | | To me, there is the Internet and there is RS
Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Okanagan
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You guys seem to think shutting down is the only path that has a negative economic impact.
What happens to the economy when something like 30-50% of your population is incapacitated for 2-6 weeks and 10% of your population die?
__________________ 1991 Toyota Celica GTFour RC // 2007 Toyota Rav4 V6 // 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee
1992 Toyota Celica GT-S ["sold"] \\ 2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee CRD [sold] \\ 2000 Jeep Cherokee [sold] \\ 1997 Honda Prelude [sold] \\ 1992 Jeep YJ [sold/crashed] \\ 1987 Mazda RX-7 [sold] \\ 1987 Toyota Celica GT-S [crushed] Quote:
Originally Posted by maksimizer half those dudes are hotter than ,my GF. | Quote:
Originally Posted by RevYouUp reading this thread is like waiting for goku to charge up a spirit bomb in dragon ball z | Quote:
Originally Posted by Good_KarMa OH thank god. I thought u had sex with my wife. :cry: | | |
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03-24-2020, 08:07 AM
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#2605 | | Where's my RS Christmas Lobster?!
Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: New Chinatown
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Originally Posted by underscore You guys seem to think shutting down is the only path that has a negative economic impact.
What happens to the economy when something like 30-50% of your population is incapacitated for 2-6 weeks and 10% of your population die? | I don't think anyone at Revscene is saying that we should do nothing, and I personally think that shutdown is a solution in the short run. I just don't think shutting everything down will be the ultimate solution until a vaccine is commercially available. Again, the emphasis has been on balance.
People die from all sorts of things, unfortunately, like car crashes and plane crashes, but did we ever ban driving and flying? We target those who are at high risk and restrict them, but we don't restrict most people or everyone from doing so. This is where the testing kits can come in handy, but I am not sure if we can get enough of them. If we do, that can be a great help.
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03-24-2020, 08:08 AM
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#2606 | | Willing to sell body for a few minutes on RS
Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Victoria
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Originally Posted by MG1 Question. I looked out my window just now and saw dude vaping. When you exhale, that shit is like a plume as big as a cloud. the smoke floats around and lingers. How dangerous is that?
Sometimes when you're driving and come up to a vaper in the next lane, you can smell that shit even when your window is up. | No more or less dangerous than exhaling normally. That same size plume is coming out of your mouth, it's just that it and the microscopic respiratory droplets in it are invisible.
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03-24-2020, 08:09 AM
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#2607 | | I subscribe to the Fight Club ONLY
Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: 604
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Originally Posted by underscore You guys seem to think shutting down is the only path that has a negative economic impact.
What happens to the economy when something like 30-50% of your population is incapacitated for 2-6 weeks and 10% of your population die? | I must say that I am surprised at the personal damage economically this is causing in such a short time. Shutdowns, lay offs have only been weeks, not even months. In terms of personal finance, what happened to the wisdom of having 2-3 months of cash for a rainy day. This is that rainy day.
I'm actually finding myself spending a whole lot less so the emergency fund should last 3-4 months, I mean it's paired down to rent, groceries, hardly anything on gas (so low anyhow), ICBC (cancelled on the other car), no going out to eat (saving lots).
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03-24-2020, 08:10 AM
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#2608 | | I subscribe to the Fight Club ONLY
Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: BC, HK, USA
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Originally Posted by underscore You guys seem to think shutting down is the only path that has a negative economic impact.
What happens to the economy when something like 30-50% of your population is incapacitated for 2-6 weeks and 10% of your population die? | No one is thinking this far yet. I'm sure we will all bounce back.... in 6 month's time.
Right now, people are still dealing with what to do when I'm at home...syndrome... good luck thinking 6 weeks ahead.
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03-24-2020, 08:15 AM
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#2609 | | Rs has made me the woman i am today!
Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Van
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Any guesses on when full shut down will be? It's like 8 am and I still see ppl lining up outside grocery stores and all the bums on East hastings are still standing 2 feet apart  | |
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03-24-2020, 08:16 AM
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#2610 | | Willing to sell body for a few minutes on RS
Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Victoria
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Originally Posted by Manic! On the Island, we have people that still think it's cool to go on car cruises in groups. | I don't really see the problem in that if these people are staying in their cars and just driving around.
It's if they're getting out and hanging out in a group that's a problem.
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1968 Mustang Coupe
2008.5 Mazdaspeed 3
1997 GMC Sonoma ZR2
2014 F150 5.0L XTR 4x4
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03-24-2020, 08:22 AM
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#2611 | | Willing to sell body for a few minutes on RS
Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Victoria
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Originally Posted by whitev70r I must say that I am surprised at the personal damage economically this is causing in such a short time. Shutdowns, lay offs have only been weeks, not even months. In terms of personal finance, what happened to the wisdom of having 2-3 months of cash for a rainy day. This is that rainy day.
I'm actually finding myself spending a whole lot less so the emergency fund should last 3-4 months, I mean it's paired down to rent, groceries, hardly anything on gas (so low anyhow), ICBC (cancelled on the other car), no going out to eat (saving lots). | You're a responsible person, many others are not and either live paycheque to paycheque and/or on heavy credit living beyond their means.
This is really going to weed out those people, and unfortunately bailing them out will be on the backs of the responsible ones like you and I.
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1968 Mustang Coupe
2008.5 Mazdaspeed 3
1997 GMC Sonoma ZR2
2014 F150 5.0L XTR 4x4
A vehicle for all occasions
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03-24-2020, 08:26 AM
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#2612 | | nuggets mod
Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: richmond
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Originally Posted by Great68 I don't really see the problem in that if these people are staying in their cars and just driving around.
It's if they're getting out and hanging out in a group that's a problem. | I would like to assume that people are that smart. I've already seen pictures of cruises where they explicitly say 'social distancing will be observed'. Then the next picture is of the 'driver safety meeting', and everyone is standing right next to each other 
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03-24-2020, 08:28 AM
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#2613 | | To me, there is the Internet and there is RS
Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Nanaimo
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Our gas station is down 30% to 40% and it's only going to get worse. We could shut down right now and we still would be financially fine. But what about other businesses? It might be better to lock almost everything down for 2 to 3 weeks and get everything under control and then fire everything back up instead letting this drag on for months.
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Until the lions have their own historians, the history of the hunt will always glorify the hunter. | |
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03-24-2020, 08:29 AM
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#2614 | | RS has made me the bitter person i am today!
Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: van
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Well now this is concerning... https://globalnews.ca/news/6720551/j...-support-bill/ Quote:
In response to the coronavirus pandemic, the federal Liberals are poised to table a bill granting them sweeping new powers to spend money and raise taxes without having to get the approval of Parliament.
Global News has seen a copy of the legislation set to be tabled Tuesday when a small number of MPs from all parties return to Ottawa to pass a multibillion-dollar coronavirus support package.
The legislation grants Finance Minister Bill Morneau extraordinary new powers to spend, borrow and tax without having to get the approval of opposition MPs until December 2021.
The Canadian Constitution enshrines taxation as a power of the parliamentary branch.
Because of that, granting those powers to the federal cabinet alone is highly unusual – even the Emergencies Act does not do so.
Effectively, the proposals would allow the government to spend money and change tax rules related to its coronavirus response without having to get the approval of the House of Commons each time they want to do so.
It also means many of the measures carried out under those new powers could take place without parliamentary debate and without the elected representatives of Canadians getting a chance to vote for or against the measures.
In a minority Parliament where each money bill that comes before the House of Commons is a confidence vote — meaning the government could fall if it fails — it also raises the prospect that the government will avoid votes of confidence on proposed new spending and taxation.
All opposition parties were surprised at the content of the bill and all singled out the extensive section which gives Morneau new powers.
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Gold is the money of kings;
Silver is the money of gentlemen;
Barter is the money of peasants;
But debt is the money of slaves.
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03-24-2020, 08:45 AM
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#2615 | | RS has made me the bitter person i am today!
Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: van
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From the same article: Quote: |
The legislation includes 20 sections, one of which will create a new Public Health Events of National Concern Payments Act that would allow any cabinet minister with the approval of the finance minister to dispense “all money required to do anything” in the event of a public health emergency. |
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Gold is the money of kings;
Silver is the money of gentlemen;
Barter is the money of peasants;
But debt is the money of slaves.
-Norm Franz
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03-24-2020, 08:55 AM
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#2616 | | Where's my RS Christmas Lobster?!
Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: New Chinatown
Posts: 867
Thanked 589 Times in 246 Posts
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Originally Posted by Great68 I don't really see the problem in that if these people are staying in their cars and just driving around.
It's if they're getting out and hanging out in a group that's a problem. | There was a group meet in Victoria about two weeks back IIRC. I wasn't there but I saw a short clip of people hanging out. I doubt something like this could happen now.
Group drive(stay in the car) is fine IMO. Quote:
Originally Posted by Manic! Our gas station is down 30% to 40% and it's only going to get worse. We could shut down right now and we still would be financially fine. But what about other businesses? It might be better to lock almost everything down for 2 to 3 weeks and get everything under control and then fire everything back up instead letting this drag on for months. | Even with a draconian lockdown like China, 2-3 weeks are a very naive thought. If things are this simple we'd be doing that already.
It may be me but maybe you should replace the M in your username with P.
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03-24-2020, 09:01 AM
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#2617 | | I *heart* Revscene.net very Muchie
Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: The Fruit Loops
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Originally Posted by welfare From the same article: | ^ They have since rescinded that. I was waiting for an article to be published first, otherwise it would just be hearsay. https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/par...tion-1.5507797 Quote: |
Late Monday, the Liberals backed away from a controversial proposal buried in the bill that would have given the government sweeping new powers to spend, borrow and tax Canadians for 21 months without parliamentary approval.
| I really hope no Canadian chose to stay in the US
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Originally Posted by GS8 When I think about ewe, I touch myself | | |
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03-24-2020, 09:05 AM
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#2618 | | I have named my kids VIC and VLS
Join Date: Oct 2001
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These sweeping tax laws are exactly the same thing that happened in WW2 etc.
Income tax proposed as a temporary measure to support war efforts, well, we know how that went. Scary honestly.
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Dank memes cant melt steel beams
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03-24-2020, 09:18 AM
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#2619 | | To me, there is the Internet and there is RS
Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Nanaimo
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India is on Lockdown for 21 days. You can't leave your house.
I'm off to Costco and a few other places wish me luck!
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Until the lions have their own historians, the history of the hunt will always glorify the hunter. | |
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03-24-2020, 09:45 AM
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#2620 | | I *heart* Revscene.net very Muchie
Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Ottawa
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Originally Posted by Manic! I'm off to Costco and a few other places wish me luck! | Maybe you and Welfare can go on a Costco shopping date. Have some hot dogs and share a poutine all while discussing your diverging political views.
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03-24-2020, 09:48 AM
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#2621 | | y'all better put some respeck on my name
Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Vancouver
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Originally Posted by underscore You guys seem to think shutting down is the only path that has a negative economic impact.
What happens to the economy when something like 30-50% of your population is incapacitated for 2-6 weeks and 10% of your population die? | Bit dramatic there.
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03-24-2020, 10:03 AM
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#2622 | | I have named my kids VIC and VLS
Join Date: Oct 2001
Posts: 36,567
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Anyone looking to defer mortgage or car payments a colleague at work said he was able to login to his lenders website and defer them through the online system for both rather than waiting on hold for hours etc
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Dank memes cant melt steel beams
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03-24-2020, 10:09 AM
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#2623 | | Willing to sell body for a few minutes on RS
Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Cloverdale
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Originally Posted by Manic! Our gas station is down 30% to 40% and it's only going to get worse. We could shut down right now and we still would be financially fine. But what about other businesses? It might be better to lock almost everything down for 2 to 3 weeks and get everything under control and then fire everything back up instead letting this drag on for months. | I mean this is why Casino's and Cruise Ships closed their doors before mandated to do so, it wasn't profitable to operate at the low numbers they were getting they saved more money just closing down rather than pay staff to operate at way below capacity or the number of guests required to turn a profit.
We have a saying in my office, sometimes we make more money on the projects we don't get and by that they mean if you can't get it for the right price the bottom line will be better off not doing it at all.
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The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place... and I donīt care how tough you are, it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently, if you let it. You, me or nobody, is gonna hit as hard as life. But ain't about how hard you hit... It's about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward... how much you can take, and keep moving forward. Thatīs how winning is done. Now, if you know what you worth, go out and get what you worth. - Rocky Balboa | |
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03-24-2020, 10:29 AM
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#2624 | | RS has made me the bitter person i am today!
Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: van
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Originally Posted by GS8 | I think the fact that it was even attempted is cause for concern.
Give it another month. could be just dipping a toe in the water.
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Gold is the money of kings;
Silver is the money of gentlemen;
Barter is the money of peasants;
But debt is the money of slaves.
-Norm Franz
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03-24-2020, 10:44 AM
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#2625 | | RS has made me the bitter person i am today!
Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: van
Posts: 4,530
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Originally Posted by Manic! India is on Lockdown for 21 days. You can't leave your house.
I'm off to Costco and a few other places wish me luck! | Watching the varying responses to this virus from different countries has been very interesting.
India started with a 14 hour lockdown. Kind of get the citizens used to the idea and see how that goes.
Now 21 days. Reassess the situation afterward.
I think it's very smart.
I personally wouldn't be going to a Costco at this point. Mind you, I'm not sure of your alternatives where you are.
Make your trips few and far between at least, if you must.
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Gold is the money of kings;
Silver is the money of gentlemen;
Barter is the money of peasants;
But debt is the money of slaves.
-Norm Franz
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