[thumper]

Tesla Model 3 first look coming March 31 as pressures mount - Roadshow (http://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/tesla-model-3-march-31-reveal-reservations-stock-troubles/)


The paint is barely dry on the first batch of Tesla Model X crossover SUVs, and the automaker's attention is already shifting to the Model 3, its long-awaited entry-level model.

On a shareholder call Wednesday, Tesla CEO Elon Musk confirmed the company will reveal more details about its pivotal new model on March 31, at which point showrooms will begin accepting $1,000 reservations. It's worth noting that the placeholder fee is markedly less expensive than the $5,000 required to get in line for the $80,000 Model X. Online reservations for the Model 3 will fire up on April 1, with Tesla insisting it will start deliveries in 2017.

The Model 3 can't come soon enough. While sales of Tesla's 4-year-old Model S were up last year, Model X production has been slow to ramp up, and in either case, the company is hemorrhaging money.

Tesla lost $889 million last year -- a record -- partially due to new model development costs and partially due to construction costs associated with its Nevada-based battery Gigafactory. Tesla has lost money for each of the last eight years. As of late, shareholders have been punishing the company's stock price, which closed at $150.43 Thursday, up nearly 5 percent but well off its 52-week high of $286.65 in July.


Elon Musk, co-founder and CEO of Tesla Motors.
Getty Images
It isn't immediately clear if Tesla will reveal the Model 3 in full next month, and details remain murky. The car is expected to be roughly the size of a BMW 3 Series (read: compact), and take on cars like Nissan's Leaf and GM's forthcoming Chevrolet Bolt, which is also expected to have in excess of 200 miles of range.

If Tesla's Model X delivery schedule is anything to go by, it's not clear how quickly reservation-holders will be able to park a Model 3 in their driveway. The Silicon Valley automaker promised to start Model X production in 2015, which it did -- barely. Although deliveries began in September, just 206 examples found homes in 2016, and production remains at a trickle.

It's also not clear how expensive the Model 3 will be when it arrives. Musk confirmed on Twitter that production won't start with a pricier Signature Series a la Model S and X, and officials have repeatedly insisted that the car will start at as little as $35,000. Federal and state tax credits promise to slash as much as $13,500 from that bottom line, which would make the Model 3 the company's first truly affordable automobile.

[brrrz]

Its my opinion that this is the car that will be the one to change everything. $35,000 for full electric and 400kms of range which most of us would expect to get north of 300kms out of it making it practical for probably 75%+ of the population that can afford it. BC government also has a $5,000 rebate on full electric vehicles putting it right at the price of cars like the Audi A3 and under the price of a BMW 3 series or Mercedes CLA.

[BBMme]

Game changer for sure. Full electric for $35k, nor bad at all

[thumper]

i wonder if our charging network could support the volume should the predicted popularity become true. the charging stations where i work are already sometimes overflowing with volts, leafs and the occasional model s even though there are restrictions on charging time.

[white rocket]

^^exactly what I was thinking. Great car, great price point, but if there's no where to "fill up" then it's kinda useless.

On a side note, my father has been on the Telsa X list for like 5 years and he's now in San Diego doing his first test drive. His ego would like him to be the first to get one here in Vancity. Would be kinda cool.

[JayEch]

Has it been confirmed that its 35K CAD?

[thumper]

Has it been confirmed that its 35K CAD?

this article came from a US website so it's $35k USD

[eclipseman]

I believe that' 35,000 USD, at least that's what is listed on US websites.

My guess is roughly 45-50k here...

[Great68]

Its my opinion that this is the car that will be the one to change everything. $35,000 for full electric and 400kms of range which most of us would expect to get north of 300kms out of it making it practical for probably 75%+ of the population that can afford it. BC government also has a $5,000 rebate on full electric vehicles putting it right at the price of cars like the Audi A3 and under the price of a BMW 3 series or Mercedes CLA.

Yeah, Tesla has been changing my opinion on electric cars.

I think that if this Model 3 is as quick, fun to drive, and practical as something like my Speed 3 and priced in the 30-40K range I'd be all over it.

It's more than just saving gas, it's the lower maintenance and hassle. It's extremely rare that I'd ever need to drive more than 400kms a day, so I can just charge at night. And of course, I always have the truck if I need a vehicle with more range.

[7seven]

Another consideration to look into is if you live in a condo/strata to check if they will let you charge your vehicle in the parking garage. A number of stratas don't.

No charge: Couple forced to move because of electric vehicle | CTV Vancouver News (http://bc.ctvnews.ca/no-charge-couple-forced-to-move-because-of-electric-vehicle-1.1987615)

[twitchyzero]

i want something that has at the very least 300 mile range because you have to remember batteries will start holding less and less charge.

estimated battery costs: Tesla Battery In The Model S Costs "Less Than A Quarter" Of The Car In Most Cases - Inside EVs (http://insideevs.com/tesla-battery-in-the-model-s-costs-less-than-a-quarter-of-the-car-in-most-cases/)

[Volvo-brickster]

Another consideration to look into is if you live in a condo/strata to check if they will let you charge your vehicle in the parking garage. A number of stratas don't.

No charge: Couple forced to move because of electric vehicle | CTV Vancouver News (http://bc.ctvnews.ca/no-charge-couple-forced-to-move-because-of-electric-vehicle-1.1987615)

or....you could just sell the car ....:badpokerface:

$500k house? or $50k car

yes let's uproot ourselves because we have no place to charge our car

[optiblue]

or....you could just sell the car ....:badpokerface:

$500k house? or $50k car

yes let's uproot ourselves because we have no place to charge our car

From the way it was presented, I think they're just renting. They approached 7 stratas to accommodate their car. It would be cheaper to just move at that point. Honda, Toyota are working on wireless charging stations. These plug in stations are already dinosaur technology.

[asian_XL]

^ why need wireless charging station, when there is wireless charging road

http://gcep.stanford.edu/images/news/wireless_car_charging_400px.jpg

[thumper]

nice, but in vancouver knowing how mayor moonbeam's mind works, it will always be spending on bike lanes, not wireless charging roads.

[mr00jimbo]

nice, but in vancouver knowing how mayor moonbeam's mind works, it will always be spending on bike lanes, not wireless charging roads.

Sadly our mayor despises all cars regardless of their power source, so he's not all that committed to any 4-wheel infrastructure. It might impede his bike rides somehow.

I've seen some separated bike lanes down such vacant and empty roads that I had to laugh and ask "why?", especially when they make the road insanely narrow for vehicles.

I don't think the province is that committed either; they get their revenue from the gasoline tax and they wanna keep it that way. They have a $5,000 rebate but it's often picked clean and not replenished.

[thumper]

i get that cars contribute to congestion and pollution in the downtown core, but not everyone can bicycle or take transit all the way from outside the gvrd.

my dad is looking at getting a hybrid rav4. sadly he was told that the rebates only now apply to pure electrics or plug in hybrids, because of the argument that retail prices for regular hybrids have dropped enough to not warrant rebates in the eyes of the gov't.

[a00755836]

Yeah, Tesla has been changing my opinion on electric cars.

I think that if this Model 3 is as quick, fun to drive, and practical as something like my Speed 3 and priced in the 30-40K range I'd be all over it.

It's more than just saving gas, it's the lower maintenance and hassle. It's extremely rare that I'd ever need to drive more than 400kms a day, so I can just charge at night. And of course, I always have the truck if I need a vehicle with more range.
my speed3 only gets 340kms per tank which is kinda embarrassing. so i actually have the same thought you have.

[Berzerker]

Does anyone have any insight on cold weather and electric cars? I know cold batteries have a severely limited capacity and poor function. Would these cars be suitable for cold climate areas?

Berz out.

[v_tec]

i get that cars contribute to congestion and pollution in the downtown core, but not everyone can bicycle or take transit all the way from outside the gvrd.

my dad is looking at getting a hybrid rav4. sadly he was told that the rebates only now apply to pure electrics or plug in hybrids, because of the argument that retail prices for regular hybrids have dropped enough to not warrant rebates in the eyes of the gov't.

It has.
- RAV4 AWD XLE - Starting from $31,900
- RAV4 AWD Limited - $37,750
- RAV4 Hybrid XLE - $34,715
- RAV4 Hybrid Limited - $38,515

I know it's not exactly apples to apples, and there's some features difference when I last compared it....but when you look at the two Limited's price, it's fairly similar already.

[xxxrsxxx]

just bumping this as it will get announced tomorrow

[thumper]

http://www.technobuffalo.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/spencer_lowell_wired_germany_tesla_001_0.jpg

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/03/30/tesla-model-3-specs-and-design-revealed-in-last-minute-leak/

Tesla is set to unveil its latest car, the Model 3 on March 31, but we still don’t know much about the affordable electric vehicle. Very little has leaked in the lead-up to the company’s big reveal, but a last minute report from Electrek may have spilled the beans.

Two standout features for the Model 3 will allegedly be the ability to go from 0-60mph in under four seconds, and an impressive range of over 300 miles per charge. However, it looks like these high-end specs may be limited to more expensive versions of the car. Tesla is expected to offer the new EV for as little as $25,000 with tax incentives included, but high-end variants could cost as much as $50,000-$60,000.

The most expensive version of the Model 3 could even outdo the Model S when it comes to battery range. Tesla may offer an 80kWh, which would make it possible to drive for almost five hours straight – nearly 364 miles – without needing to charge. That’s better than the Model S 90D, which can hit 288 miles per charge.

The report also offers a bit more information on the Model 3’s mysterious design, which a source describes as “sexy and sporty,” adding that “it seems so right.” The car apparently looks like a hybrid of the Model X and Model S design, though the front is closer to the Model X in style. Additionally, Wired Germany has published an alleged image of the Model 3 hiding under a black cloth.

Tesla is set to unveil the Model 3 tomorrow. You can reserve the new car as soon as it’s announced, but it won’t actually be ready until at least late 2017.

[thumper]

Elon Musk wanted to name his Model 3 Model E so Tesla?s brands would spell SEX. This and other secrets about his newest car | Financial Post (http://business.financialpost.com/news/transportation/elon-musk-wanted-to-name-his-model-3-model-e-so-teslas-brands-would-spell-sex-this-and-other-secrets-about-his-newest-car)

Elon Musk wanted to name his Model 3 Model E so Tesla’s brands would spell SEX. This and other secrets about his newest car

Tom Randall, Bloomberg News | March 30, 2016 3:58 PM ET
More from Bloomberg News
There are reports that the Tesla 3, Elon Musk's entry level car that will be unveiled Thursday, is based on the Audi 4 and the BMW 3 series.

Tesla is getting ready for its biggest-ever unveiling: the Model 3, the US$35,000& sedan designed to take electric cars mainstream. As the fateful date approaches, the company has been dropping hints about what to expect from a project that has been a decade in the making. With just one day left before the big show, here’s everything we know, as well as a few things we’ll be watching for on March 31:

Roomy, like an Audi A4

The Model 3 will be about 20 per cent smaller than the Model S, or roughly the size of an Audi A4, said chief executive officer Elon Musk. The A4 is a five-seater that feels a bit roomier than some of its rivals in the compact luxury category. (The Model 3 will compete with BMW’s 3 series in the class of entry luxury cars). Backseat riders might gain some leg room because an electric drive-train obviates the need for a transmission tunnel, the hump in the middle of the floor. There’s also no engine in an electric car, and Tesla likes to use that empty space for a “frunk” — front trunk — for extra storage. Will that feature survive in the smaller Model 3?

Ready to ride

The Model 3 is now the company’s top priority and is “going to be probably the most profound car that we make,” according to Musk. At this week’s event, a working prototype will be ready onsite to take reporters for “a quick spin,” according to invitations sent out March 15. Musk had previously indicated he might not show the full car, which won’t officially go on sale until late 2017. It will be interesting to see how “finished” the prototype is and determine how much is still being worked out.

Mini Model S?

The biggest unknown about the Model 3 is its look. Will it have the distinctive oval front end of the Model S or the tight-lipped mouth of the Model X? What about those huge windshields? Tesla may have given a clue with the invitations, which feature pictures of the Model S, the Model X, and a silhouette in place of the Model 3.

As some Tesla watchers have pointed out, the silhouette is a perfect match for the Model S. So was the image just a Photoshop trick, or will the Model 3 look very much like a shorter version of the Model S? When asked via e-mail if the company would like to clarify, a Tesla spokesperson simply replied: “Ha.”

Related
Wall Street tours Tesla factory — and loves what it sees — as company poised to release its first mass-market car
In California, these minivans-turned-RVs take car camping to the next level
PDAC 2016: How lithium has become a rare winner amid the commodity slaughter
A reservation for 3

Tesla is reportedly already taking reservations from employees looking to buy the Model 3 and will offer the rest of us the same chance at its showrooms on the morning of March 31, before the unveiling. Online reservations at the newly acquired domain Tesla.com begin at the start of the event — 8:30 p.m. West Coast time. A deposit of US$1,000 is required up front, but it’s refundable at any time.

Get in line

Even if Tesla’s late 2017 delivery goal is successful — a big if, given the company’s record of missing deadlines — it could still be a while before production ramps up. Whenever deliveries start, reservations from previous Tesla owners and those buying highly optioned versions of the car will be first in line. In other words, get those deposits in as soon as you can if you want a Model 3 in the near future.

No Signature Series

Unlike Tesla’s premium luxury cars, the Model 3 won’t come in a souped-up Signature Series. Don’t worry, though. The carmaker will still be happy to take your money for upgrades, possibly including a bigger battery, all-wheel drive, autopilot, and ludicrous speed. In February, Musk expressed regret over how a hefty US$140,000 Signature Series price tag became associated with the Model X SUV before the rollout of the US$80,000 base version. Tesla has been careful to brand the new Model 3 as a US$35,000 car and will want to keep it that way, even if the average bill ends up closer to US$50,000.

Marcio Jose Sanchez/Associated Press
Marcio Jose Sanchez/Associated PressTesla's Model X SUV.

Free range

Tesla promises a range of at least 200 miles (322 kilometres) per charge. If it offers the same 60 kilowatt hour lithium-ion battery pack planned for the 2017 Chevy Bolt, its range could beat that mile-marker considerably, based on the Model 3’s small size and the performance of other, larger Teslas. It’s even conceivable that Tesla could meet its 200-mile goal with a cheaper 50 kWh pack. On the flip side, upgrades could allow for batteries as big as the 90 kWh pack currently available on the Model S.

There will only be one (for now)

Despite some speculation to the contrary, only one car is to be unveiled this week: the Model 3 sedan. Rumors circulated that Tesla might also announce a crossover vehicle, but the company says this event will focus exclusively on the Model 3. The Model 3’s skateboard chassis will be used for additional models later, beginning with the popular crossover class, according to the company. (One person not likely to be seen at the Model 3 unveiling: Tesla’s former chief spokesman, Ricardo Reyes. He left the company just two weeks before the unveiling; neither Reyes nor the company has offered an explanation.)

All-new platform

This will be Tesla’s third auto platform: the Roadster, the Model S and X, and now the Model 3. To make the Model 3 affordable and adaptable, Tesla had to start from the ground up. “For better or worse, most of Model 3 has to be new,” Chief technology officer JB Straubel said in October. “It’s a new battery architecture, it’s a new motor technology, brand new vehicle structure. It’s a lot of work.” Straubel, Musk, and Jason Wheeler, Telsa’s new chief financial officer, have stressed how much the Model 3 has been designed for ease of manufacturing in order to move quickly and cheaply into mass production numbers. Question: How much of the car will be made of lightweight aluminum vs. cheaper steel?

Justin Chin/Bloomberg News
Justin Chin/Bloomberg NewsElon Musk, founder of Tesla Motors, has said In addition to being "a slightly smaller version of the Model S," the Model 3" won't have quite as many bells and whistles."
About those new batteries

The new battery’s composition will particularly interest electric vehicle watchers because it accounts for a third of each car’s price tag. Any significant improvements in cost or energy density could help push the entire industry forward. In a February earnings call, Musk assured investors that Tesla’s massive battery factory in Nevada is on schedule and will be producing both battery cells and finished packs by the end of this year. “You shouldn’t worry about the Gigafactory as a constraint,” Musk said.

At what price?

The basic Model 3& will cost US$35,000 before government incentives, which in the U.S. range from US$7,500 to more than US$13,000, depending on the state. Tesla’s federal incentives will begin to phase out when the company reaches 200,000 in cumulative U.S. sales — probably in 2018, according to data compiled by Bloomberg. That could reduce the chance of anyone getting their hands on a Tesla for less than US$30,000, as initial deliveries will be for pricier versions of the car.

Expect fewer whistles

In addition to being “a slightly smaller version of the Model S,” Musk said in Hong Kong in January, “it won’t have quite as many bells and whistles.” Will the company keep its standard 17-inch dashboard touchscreen? Brake assist? Cupholders? What new tricks might Tesla have up its sleeve?

New factories, coming soon

In addition to the flagship Fremont Factory in California, which the company has been building at a rapid clip, and the battery Gigafactory in Nevada, Tesla aims to open additional Model 3 factories in China and Europe as soon as 2018.

Ellon Musk @elonmusk

Model 3 is due in 2 yrs. A China factory for local demand cd be as soon as a year after. A factory in Europe wd happen for same reason. Twitter: Elon Musk on TwitterAutonomous-Ready

Long warranty

The Model 3 will have a warranty similar to that for the Model S, including an eight-year, infinite-mile, transferable warranty on the battery pack and drive unit, Musk said on Twitter in August 2014. That’s important because Consumer Reports dinged the company last year for reports of excessive drivetrain problems.

Don’t call it the Model III

The car’s logo may be three parallel bars, but don’t call it the Model III, Musk told followers on Twitter. The bars should be horizontal, similar to the stylized “E” in the Tesla logo. That’s no mistake: Musk originally wanted to call it the Model E, which would spell out “SEX” with his full lineup of Model names. He had to settle for “Model 3” because Ford wouldn’t give up the trademark it owns.

Reason for skepticism

The Model S is now the best-selling large luxury vehicle in the U.S. With the Model 3, Tesla will be competing in a much larger, better-established category. No matter how much some electric car enthusiasts care about reducing pollution, good intentions don’t sell category-winning cars. The Model 3 will need to compete on its merits: drivability, reliability, safety, cost, convenience, comfort, and style. Tesla has a good record, but so does its new class of peers.

Bloomberg News

[asian_XL]

Have been waiting for 9hr lol

[Bender Unit]

:badpokerface: You line up overnight at Tesla HK for the reseveration ?

[asian_XL]

:badpokerface: You line up overnight at Tesla HK for the reseveration ?

It is now 9:30am, store opens and reservation starts at 10am...

[SFU_wmc]

^ you mean you didn't tell your maid to go, and actually lined up yourself??!

[Harvey Specter]

I'm not a fan of Tesla but I have to give Elon credit for doing what all the other big car manufactures refused to do which was develop full electric car and basically give big oil the middle finger.

[asian_XL]

When you live in a city where gas price is 2dollar a litre, this is why so many people want one.

The model 3 is the same price as a 1.4L Golf in my city, plus the gas saving = win

[Bender Unit]

It is now 9:30am, store opens and reservation starts at 10am...

Huge line or what?
I know the Tesla S is very popular in HK

[asian_XL]

Around 50 people when the store opened, there are 3 locations in HK. I was the first one! w00t!

[Great68]

I can't believe I'm actually excited for an electric car reveal!

[thumper]

please don't let it look remotely like this...:Puke:

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSkP4CETX48zJbACnzbS4BSEiR4-qFytc1Vo1Oe7NxkM8DZb_zPWg

[Galactic_Phantom]

When you live in a city where gas price is 2dollar a litre, this is why so many people want one.

The model 3 is the same price as a 1.4L Golf in my city, plus the gas saving = win

It makes total sense to have a Tesla in HK, but do you own your own house by any chance? I would assume its a pain in the ass for those living in apartments since not all spots will have access to chargers

[asian_XL]

Well the reservation is fully refundable
I guess people did not know it starts today.

[twitchyzero]

are there gov't incentives for EVs in HK?

inb4 911/M2/M3/NSX/S2000/ITR tax

the hype is real la~

[asian_XL]

It makes total sense to have a Tesla in HK, but do you own your own house by any chance? I would assume its a pain in the ass for those living in apartments since not all spots will have access to chargers

There are 3500 model S in HK and 7 supercharging stations and tons of quick chargers around town, supercharging takes 1hr from 10% to 90%.

There are contractors that will install a Tesla quick charger right beside ur parking stall for about 3grand, assume you own the spot with cover and your strata has no objection.

Or... you plug ur car to a regular power outlet, it takes 40hrs lol

[asian_XL]

are there gov't incentives for EVs in HK?

inb4 911/M2/M3/NSX/S2000/ITR tax

the hype is real la~

No incentive... but you dont need to pay 1st time registration tax, that's almost 100% of a gasoline car price.

So a model S P70D is roughly around the price of a Mercedes E200 or BMW 328i

[twitchyzero]

:fulloffuck: how do you folks survive there...crazy ass car tax, massive real estate costs AND limited political freedom

we should send all the whiny Vancouverites to HK

[asian_XL]

:fulloffuck: how do you folks survive there...crazy ass car tax, massive real estate costs AND limited political freedom

we should send all the whiny Vancouverites to HK

We have low income tax, no sales tax, currency is tied with USD, and a lot of financial jobs to choose.

[twitchyzero]

Vancouver's Tesla fans line up to plonk down deposits on mysterious, lower-cost Model 3 (http://www.vancouversun.com/news/local+news/vancouver+tesla+fans+line+plonk+down+deposits+myst erious/11819126/story.html)
Electric vehicle fan all revved up about the new Tesla (http://www.bchydro.com/news/conservation/2016/ev-fan-loves-tesla.html)

[Hehe]

I'm honestly thinking about dropping by Tesla tomorrow for a deposit before a meeting in the area.

It's fully refundable... so if I don't like what I see, I take it back. If I don't like it enough, and someone else is, I might be able to make a few bucks for the trouble and finally if I like what I see, I'd be one of the first in NA to roll on it (Tesla stated shipments starts on West Coast for all preorders).

What's there to lose? Opportunity cost on 1000CAD? (minus the points on credit card)? :fuckthatshit:

[will068]

Vancouver's Tesla fans line up to plonk down deposits on mysterious, lower-cost Model 3 (http://www.vancouversun.com/news/local+news/vancouver+tesla+fans+line+plonk+down+deposits+myst erious/11819126/story.html)
Electric vehicle fan all revved up about the new Tesla (http://www.bchydro.com/news/conservation/2016/ev-fan-loves-tesla.html)


Yeah, I saw the line up on Robson this evening. Reminded me of a Saturday Jordan release. Let the hype begin.

[asian_XL]

Tesla Model 3 Does 0-60 in Under 4 Seconds, 300 Mile Range, Says Report

Tesla Model 3 Does 0-60 in Under 4 Seconds, Says Leak (http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/news/a28654/tesla-model-3-does-0-60-in-under-4-seconds-says-leak/)

[Vale46Rossi]

My family recently purchased a P90D in Hong Kong (at the exact location you are at) The pricing is so damn cheap even compared to Vancouver..... The BC government should really give better incentives than the 5000$ they offer here.... The P85D I ordered prior came up to way too expensive.... So I bought something else instead =/

[asian_XL]

ah, yes, if include sales tax, then it will be 30k more expensive in Canada.

[fliptuner]

Just drove past the store DT. Lineup is all the way around the block lol.

[thumper]

Just drove past the store DT. Lineup is all the way around the block lol.

Vancouver's Tesla fans line up to plonk down deposits on mysterious, lower-cost Model 3 (http://www.vancouversun.com/news/local+news/vancouver+tesla+fans+line+plonk+down+deposits+myst erious/11819126/story.html)

https://postmediavancouversun2.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/tesla_226864430.jpg?w=640

[MG1]

They're saying the Model 3 may take till 2019, lol. I'm hoping that by then, some of the other car manufacturers will get their shit together and join in.

[shawnly1000]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/715637755598901248

[dat_steve]

No gears, just instant torque. And yes, the car has a smaller version of Tesla "insane mode" (more like short burst). It's like Vtec on steroids, hee hee.


I think it's also called "ludicrous speed"

http://static2.fjcdn.com/comments/It+s+been+18+years+_835d8a4d0b87352a563bb22f5a39a0 02.jpg

or

http://www.kboing.com.br/fotos/imagens/49d3bdd19b64e.jpg

[gwh0803]

Imagine all the torque dumped on the static drivetrain on a launch...I'm more than curious on how they work out the gearing lubrication and the transient response on the suspension.

[xxxrsxxx]

what's the fine print on the refundable deposit

[asian_XL]

Remember, the store only takes ur name, phone, address and email, that's all. An email will be sent to you for immediate credit card payment.

[Gerbs]

what's the fine print on the refundable deposit
https://www.teslamotors.com/sites/default/files/pdfs/model_3_reservation_agreement.pdf?_ga=1.186368937. 1469776717.1426907669

anyone research the incentives?
https://www.cevforbc.ca/clean-energy-vehicle-program

[TOPEC]

https://model3.tesla.com/

for people who want to watch the reveal live

u can also reserve ur model 3 on that website with cc details

[bcuzracecarz]

You can actually see his brain turning as he speaks, he's so far ahead of the normal persons mind it's astounding

[!Aznboi128]

hmmmm the looks isnt all that great tho it has very similar design language as the S and X

[Gh0stRider]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7aou-WIAAM3tB.jpg:large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7aihZXEAENaDk.jpg:large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7a2JGWsAAOKYd.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7bmxjWwAAl8gg.jpg:large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7ct09W8AAqpQw.jpg:large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7crBBXIAAibFz.jpg:large

[noclue]

looks kinda like a panamera.
Bit disappointed in the glass roof, you can't block the sun fully and the chances of it rattling is much higher.

Other than that for 35KUSD it's a sweet car.

[Teriyaki]

Tesla just took my monies.

[Gh0stRider]

115,000 preorders, damn

215 miles per charge

[asian_XL]

Fuck, i want my money back, the bumper, the dash, the steering wheel... wtf!

[Hondaracer]

looks pretty dece for the price

[!Aznboi128]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7aq2GXIAA8own.jpg:large

that interior is super plain, minimalistic

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--n7lND151--/c_scale,fl_progressive,q_80,w_800/zz9dnxhba5k5u338q5pb.png

not sure about the looks... the wheels are really big

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7cUl4XIAI9fLK.jpg:large

this looks better....

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7bJbCWIAAC72z.jpg:large[/IMG

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ce7cEe5WwAAKa13.jpg:large

back is also very plain

Edit: looks like Gh0strider updated his post with pics lol

[Cwift]

the interior looks like they just want everybody to just put it in the autopilot mode

[TOPEC]

base stats 0-60 in 6 secs, 215 miles range, $35,000 USD, not the best looks tho

so tesla now has the model S 3 X in their line up

hm...

[Gh0stRider]

!Aznboi128, we found the same images hah

[!Aznboi128]

!Aznboi128, we found the same images hah
lol yea i just linked a bunch from twitter

[bcuzracecarz]

Fuck, i want my money back, the bumper, the dash, the steering wheel... wtf!

Is that an option? I have no idea how it works

[Gh0stRider]

Is that an option? I have no idea how it works

yup

Until you enter into a Purchase Agreement, your Reservation may be cancelled at
any time, in which case you will receive a full refund of your Reservation Payment.

https://www.teslamotors.com/sites/default/files/pdfs/model_3_reservation_agreement.pdf

[bcuzracecarz]

Tesla Model 3: This Is It (http://jalopnik.com/tesla-model-3-this-is-it-1768284734)

[Nlkko]

I think it needs a grill accessory in the look department.

Gonna wait for actual review until ordering one for the parents.

[threezero]

I think it needs a grill accessory in the look department.

Gonna wait for actual review until ordering one for the parents.

maybe it looks better with a license plate? dunno lol

[asian_XL]

It will be the next civic... time to get some body kit, big rims, lowering springs

[thumper]

https://youtu.be/Q4VGQPk2Dl8

[LP700-4]

Im sure the design is functional and aerodynamic and everything but it looks so weird. Looks like someone with a nose but no nostrils :yuno:

[snowball]

http://fossforce.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/matrix-neo-no-mouth.jpg

[twitchyzero]

i can't be the only person that thinks affordable RWD with instant torque + vancouver rainy streets means a fucking disaster...i don't even think the best all seasons will save the people that upgrading from their petrol Civic which they're used to flooring...

also i dont like a ipad pro XL sticking out...wish they went with curved OLED flush in the dash. Grilless not the best looking but I think for the price it's really amazing...i really hope Tesla takes off even if the projected reservations will take 4 years from now to deliver

[Galactic_Phantom]

These ARE just highly detailed concepts right? Wheres the speedometer? Or are they going with full head up display for speed?

[SkinnyPupp]

The dash console is an ipad? :fulloffuck:

[Gucci Mane]

^ its a 15" screen that controls everything.

no thank you.

[twitchyzero]

the attendees at the reveal are uploading their quick rides in the prototype
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1N47Rn2vrc0

The dash console is an ipad? :fulloffuck:

something like this from Audi but in the center...then compliment with crucial info like speedo/autopilot/warning indicators as HUD on the windshield. As long as it's flush and clean and not sticking out like almost every current design from major manufacturers.

http://icdn1.digitaltrends.com/image/2016-audi-tt-dash-cluster-1500x1000.jpg

[Reeyal]

The 15" screen is way too big for that cabin, and no behind the steering wheel instrument cluster... I guess that's acceptable for 35k.

[thumper]

i know it's just a prototype, but wow those headlights are useless...

[Great68]

That's a bit disappointing.

[Z3guy]

I am not sure what you guys are expecting for a car 1/3 of the price of a Model S??? I think Tesla is revolutionizing the automobile. He is not following the traditional concept of car making. He is creating the automobile like a giant mobile tech device. When is the last time you have seen line ups to a buy a car. The fact 115,000 people put deposits down for a Tesla 3 is quite amazing. Let's face it Tesla is not a car for the enthusiasts. It is at best the daily driver car for the car enthusiast.

[hud 91gt]

I personally think it hit all my expectations. Looks great.

[Bender Unit]

I am not sure what you guys are expecting for a car 1/3 of the price of a Model S??? I think Tesla is revolutionizing the automobile. He is not following the traditional concept of car making. He is creating the automobile like a giant mobile tech device. When is the last time you have seen line ups to a buy a car. The fact 115,000 people put deposits down for a Tesla 3 is quite amazing. Let's face it Tesla is not a car for the enthusiasts. It is at best the daily driver car for the car enthusiast.
Exactly. Nailed it right to the points.

[SkinnyPupp]

I am not sure what you guys are expecting for a car 1/3 of the price of a Model S??? I think Tesla is revolutionizing the automobile. He is not following the traditional concept of car making. He is creating the automobile like a giant mobile tech device. When is the last time you have seen line ups to a buy a car. The fact 115,000 people put deposits down for a Tesla 3 is quite amazing. Let's face it Tesla is not a car for the enthusiasts. It is at best the daily driver car for the car enthusiast.
Sure but it just looks so.. unfinished. It's still a $35,000 car, but looks like it was built in some engineer's garage as a side project, using an ipad as the center console...

It just looks weird. Everything else about it is amazing.

[Z3guy]

^ I don't disagree with you SkinnyPupp, but you are commenting from a car enthusiasts standpoint. I think most buyers will be the early adopters who want the latest gadget, just like the newest mac book, Iphone, flat screen TV. I bet most buyers will not even care too much about the driving dynamics.

I would take the Tesla 3 any day of the week over a Prius. It is hard to put a price tag on the kool factor.

[thumper]

Sure but it just looks so.. unfinished. It's still a $35,000 car, but looks like it was built in some engineer's garage as a side project, using an ipad as the center console...

It just looks weird. Everything else about it is amazing.


does anyone know if this is the "final" design? will there be changes/revisions before production starts late 2017?

[SkinnyPupp]

^ I don't disagree with you SkinnyPupp, but you are commenting from a car enthusiasts standpoint. I think most buyers will be the early adopters who want the latest gadget, just like the newest mac book, Iphone, flat screen TV. I bet most buyers will not even care too much about the driving dynamics.

I would take the Tesla 3 any day of the week over a Prius. It is hard to put a price tag on the kool factor.
I think it matters even more to non car people. They don't necessarily notice the fine details, but a design means quite a bit to the every day buyer. Of course there is enough hype that people are losing their minds getting these, so I guess it doesn't matter

[roastpuff]

does anyone know if this is the "final" design? will there be changes/revisions before production starts late 2017?

There will be changes. These are prototypes right now.

[MarkyMark]

I doubt it matters, with the hype behind it and I bet there will be huge waiting lists just to get it creating more hype, this will be the iPhone of cars.

As boring as the interior looks, a huge touchscreen is still "cooler" than plastic buttons to a lot of people.

[thumper]

jalopnik is bitching about the trunk not being a hatch...

This Is The Tesla Model 3's Biggest Design Fail (http://jalopnik.com/this-is-the-tesla-model-3s-biggest-design-fail-1768467573)

[Nlkko]

Hat tip to Tesla. Proof that you can make a tree-hugger-car cool and fast. Toyota, Nissan and GM can fire their EV product design team.

Uni-display panel is great. Less part to go wrong and helps keeps price (and maintenance cost) down. Also more room for everything. Can't wait to see the ugly Prius gets less presence.

I would love if interior gets simplified everywhere among auto manufacturer. You can haul more around (stuffs and people) without building massive fat and ugly ass vehicles.

[thumper]

Hat tip to Tesla. Proof that you can make a tree-hugger-car cool and fast. Toyota, Nissan and GM can fire their EV product design team.

Uni-display panel is great. Less part to go wrong and helps keeps price (and maintenance cost) down. Also more room for everything. Can't wait to see the ugly Prius gets less presence.

I would love if interior gets simplified everywhere. You can haul more around (stuffs and people) without building massive fat and ugly ass vehicle.

but if that display takes a crap, you would lose everything...

[Nlkko]

Sure there is cloud backup and everything lol.

[twitchyzero]

speaking to one of the reps in-store today the chassis will be partial aluminum
many firsts here for an affordable car...wiki suggests they need to ship 0.5M units to even be profitable

I know the pano roof is optional...hope they make it with an adjustment switch (0-100% variable tint)

[asian_XL]

Model S prototype interior

http://www.drivearabia.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/tesla-model-s-6.jpg
http://d2dzlucogpu6qo.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/tesla-dash-1.jpg

Exterior
http://www.drivearabia.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/tesla-model-s-1.jpg
http://www.speedsportlife.com/wp-content/2009/03/models3.jpg

[scoobyej20]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v335/BlitzScooby/Share/Capture.png (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BlitzScooby/media/Share/Capture.png.html)

[Ferra]

Sure but it just looks so.. unfinished. It's still a $35,000 car, but looks like it was built in some engineer's garage as a side project, using an ipad as the center console...

It just looks weird. Everything else about it is amazing.
everyone are using an ipad screen as center console nowadays (2017 Audi A4, Benz C & CLA, BMW, Mazda..etc etc)

I hate it too, but you should probably get used to it
At least their screen is much bigger than everyone else :badpokerface:

[hud 91gt]

That model S has sex written all over it.

[Hondaracer]

i'd rather have an ipad i know is going to work smooth/well and consistently than some other 3rd part peripheral which isn't as good of a processor/touch screen

a lot of people i know in finance dont see much of a future for Tesla as an auto-maker, they just dont have the ability to keep up with demand, and even with the new factory, a 3 year wait list is going to be a killer for profit.

most seem to think down the road there will be more electric cars from other major manufacturers but "powered by Tesla" in terms of their batteries etc.

i know a few people with the Model S though and it really does seem like a fantastic car

[Mr.Money]

no one even knows the durability how they are going to be...i really wonder if they have any whistler buyers and how's that going to go in Ice cold weather,or if any Weird issues come up....i guess we'll have some early Testers and see how much tesla hold there value!..

[scoobyej20]

https://youtu.be/TelUR5Bg9zE

no one even knows the durability how they are going to be...i really wonder if they have any whistler buyers and how's that going to go in Ice cold weather,or if any Weird issues come up....i guess we'll have some early Testers and see how much tesla hold there value!..

[Retrac]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v335/BlitzScooby/Share/Capture.png (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/BlitzScooby/media/Share/Capture.png.html)

Did they give you a estimate to when you'll receive the car?

[SkinnyPupp]

Did they give you a estimate to when you'll receive the car?
I don't want to be rude, but... does it look like it? Sorry I had to say something.. you're reading the entire email there

[bicboi]

Have one on order as well. I am expecting delivery late 2018/early 2019 based on current information.

[Retrac]

Lol was hoping that wasn't all the information given.

[bicboi]

Sorry Retrac, to clarify Tesla did not state an estimated delivery date. Its more of a wild guess on my end lol.

[Retrac]

Lol I was able to figure that out on my own :drunk:

But damn, no ETA on arrival, you're in this for the long haul eh?

[Nlkko]

Elon said in the key note they hope to begin production late 2017. So likely early 2018 for delivery.

[Timpo]

Tesla is amazing and it is in its own class.

People who don't like Ford, GM and Chrysler are buying Tesla too. It doesn't even seem like an American manufacture...or seems like higher quality American manufacture. Like Apple, Boeing, IBM, etc..

[Timpo]

Is Tesla still owned by Toyota?

Why Toyota and Tesla Are Getting a Divorce - DailyFinance (http://www.dailyfinance.com/on/toyota-tesla-divorce-electric-cars/)

[inv4zn]

I made this for you Timpo
http://i.imgur.com/hM5VBMg.jpg

[thumper]

Lol I was able to figure that out on my own :drunk:

But damn, no ETA on arrival, you're in this for the long haul eh?

this reminds me of back in the old soviet days when people finally able to afford a new car, put in their deposits for a lada, get put on a waiting list, and then wait forever because there is no ETA on arrival...

[thumper]

no one even knows the durability how they are going to be...i really wonder if they have any whistler buyers and how's that going to go in Ice cold weather,or if any Weird issues come up....i guess we'll have some early Testers and see how much tesla hold there value!..

i don't think there is an issue for whistler owners. there is even a tesla supercharger in squamish:

https://www.teslamotors.com/en_CA/findus/location/supercharger/squamishsupercharger

[scoobyej20]

here's some nice Model S pictures.. just as easy to make the Model 3 look good imo.

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/nice-model-s-png.20542

http://forum.exotics4life.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=31299&d=1391805262

http://tsportline.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/hawk-black-out-edition-t-sportline-model-s-4-new.jpg

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3916/14258476729_f6892277e2_b.jpg

http://gtspirit.com/wp-content/gallery/gallery-tesla-model-s-on-adv-1-wheels/tesla_model_s_adv5-2tscs_09_960.jpg

http://gtspirit.com/wp-content/gallery/adv-1-wheels-tesla-model-s/tesla-model-s-4.jpg

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/tesla_model_s_02_004-jpg.141838/

[swfk]

Parents ordered their Model 3 as well, getting some sort of priority since they are current owners. RHD though so GG...

Friend's Model S I shot some photos of in December:
https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xlf1/t31.0-8/12466190_10156395356155015_2599765144073680224_o.j pg

https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xlt1/v/t1.0-9/1915861_10156374576585015_3418276146917078881_n.jp g?oh=b55cd774c5730664857c0a91daa70c25&oe=57BDE624

[asian_XL]

WoW, this looks great
http://www.zev.dk/web/Model3nosejob.jpg

A BMW grill will fix the front, lol, found the image on Tesla club forum

[asian_XL]

http://i.imgur.com/kvSSm2X.jpg
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/ashrzb4-jpg.170271/
https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/attachments/m3-front-jpg.170325/

[SoNaRWaVe]

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/715934657720639488

https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/716341849409998849

that gigawatt factory better be at 100% efficiency/capacity soon lol

[asian_XL]

didn't Musk say the new factory can do 500k cars a year?

[68style]

I would hope it's capable, Ford was selling 400,000+ Mustangs a year in the 60's with no robots and nothing resembling lean efficiency in place. Considering the lack of drivetrain parts it's also much less complicated to put together than a conventional car.

[thumper]

I would hope it's capable, Ford was selling 400,000+ Mustangs a year in the 60's with no robots and nothing resembling lean efficiency in place. Considering the lack of drivetrain parts it's also much less complicated to put together than a conventional car.

but back in those days, ford was doing everything in house, even making their own steel, not getting parts from outsourcing or outside suppliers, and they had more than one assembly plant going at the same time. i don't know how many manufacturing plants tesla has (i know they have one in europe making the model s that is running at capacity), and they also have to make versions for overseas markets as well.

[68style]

If they're using TPS it shouldn't be a problem though. Their biggest restriction is the physical size of the factory and having enough money to make it happen... Which, considering they just "borrowed" $253million and counting interest free for the next 1.5 years (Model3 deposits), should make things a lot easier.

[asian_XL]

I wonder how much the 253K+ reservation has shocked the auto industry...just like when Apple introduced iphone 4, people went crazy, and every company jumped onto their boat to make something similar.

Toyota, GM, BMW, and Nissan Management would have been calling meetings like crazy these days.

I am the only person in the family who paid the reservation, the day it was announced I got 10+ message from my uncles and cousins asking whether they should wait or reserve one immediately. The actual numbers could be doubling or tripling.

[Nlkko]

These bozos probably still trying to figure how to make that same car and only charge 35k or less and have infrastructure in place to support. They havent innovated anything for years, still making the same old ICE vehicles and boring ass Prius with the shitiest designs year over year saved for BMW.

But Elon is also bat shit crazy, known to bet the farm on his work. High risk high reward. Wonder if they can do half a mil or even a mil reservation by next year.

[twitchyzero]

Is it a proprietary plug at Tesla charging stations? or does the system just not recognize non-Teslas and won't allow charge? I hope the other companies that jump in at the EV hype won't create proprietary stations.

Elon said in the key note they hope to begin production late 2017. So likely early 2018 for delivery.

yeah for employees/current owners
then next priority is US west coast...no word on Canada. If you didn't line-up or reserve the eve of the announcement I'd hazard a guess you won't get delivery until H2 2019. Don't forget that the X despite being a different beast was delayed twice by almost 2 years

i don't know how many manufacturing plants tesla has (i know they have one in europe making the model s that is running at capacity), and they also have to make versions for overseas markets as well.

I don't think there's any in Europe? just the one in Fremont and the gigafactory in Nevada that's not even fully operational yet. I think there's talks about opening another gigafactory in Japan

[thumper]

I don't think there's any in Europe? just the one in Fremont and the gigafactory in Nevada that's not even fully operational yet. I think there's talks about opening another gigafactory in Japan

https://www.teslamotors.com/en_CA/blog/tesla-motors-opens-assembly-plant-tilburg-netherlands

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/photo-essays/2015-10-13/check-out-tesla-s-hot-new-european-factory

http://assets.bwbx.io/images/iD_4mBsv_o2U/v1/-1x-1.jpg

[thumper]

here's something i didn't know. amsterdam taxi service uses the tesla model s in their fleet... 167 of them :eek: :

https://chargedevs.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/Schiphol-Airport-Teslas.jpg

Home - Taxi Electric (http://www.taxielectric.nl/en/)

[tiger_handheld]

I have the biggest hard on for Tesla, but to those who made reservations:

1- is it $35,000 CAD or USD?
2- have you read this: Tesla Model 3 vs. Chevrolet Bolt: Battle of the long-range EVs (http://mashable.com/2016/04/02/chevrolet-bolt-ev-versus-tesla-model-3/#nY7Gr3wVYPqd) - thoughts?

[Nlkko]

^ The only thing that would go against the Model 3 is possible delay in delivery. Dude has design for the Bolt. Really? It looks like every other ugly hybrid/EV.

The Superchargers are proprietary in the sense that it currently locks to Tesla owners only. If they decide to share it (very likely) then they will just do a software unlock. It's free for Tesla owners so they'll probably have to charge something/work out or deal with other car manufacturers.

Most of the charging is done at home anyways so it's not like it's a huge cost to them.

[asian_XL]

there is no way the Bolt is going to win the battle, only advantage GM has is the production line and ready to be delivered in 2017, but with all the Model 3 publicity people are ready to wait.

Will BMW make something similar? I guess they continue the i-B$, then make all their series with the e-option (plug in hybrid)
Will Toyota make something similar? Good luck with the Prius design
Will Nissan and VW make something similar? they are the best Tesla rivals, the e-golf, e-up, Renault Zoe, Leaf. Without something new this year, their market share will definitely get swallowed in 2017.


EDIT: 276K by end of Sat...crazy

[MG1]

god, it's going to be a long wait for some people. Good thing you can get your money back. I'll wait until first wave of problems sort themselves out.

[LP700-4]

So its 35k usd base price. They mentioned average optioned car will be 42k usd.

Canadians are paying 46-55k cad?(who knows what exchange will be when it finally out)

Is it worth for an electric car? Will fuel costs saved be worth it?

[SkinnyPupp]

Will fuel costs saved be worth it?

As if that's the only reason to go electric...

[68style]

It's kind of a "hide the weenie" game for electric cars... They still use lots of fossil fuels in production (plastics, etc) and electricity isn't made for free especially in California they buy it from BC... And lithium batteries are absolute toxic nightmares.... I think the go green people are a little out to lunch nevermind the people trying to "save money on gas" by spending $55k+ on a new vehicle.

[Nlkko]

^ I would invite you to study more about EVs. This is a post Elon post 10 years ago that explains some of the environmental effects of EVs:

https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/secret-tesla-motors-master-plan-just-between-you-and-me

There is not a single doubt it is greener than internal combustion engine cars. I will still keep my V8 luxury car because it's a toy and because I can. But for daily driver, I will drive a Tesla any days.

It is not 100% clean, yet. But it's a step in the right direction.

[Ulic Qel-Droma]

I would hope it's capable, Ford was selling 400,000+ Mustangs a year in the 60's with no robots and nothing resembling lean efficiency in place. Considering the lack of drivetrain parts it's also much less complicated to put together than a conventional car.

the computer and battery both probably take more effort in parts, design, and materials and putting together than a whole car from the 60's haha...

[Hehe]

My wife put down a deposit for delivery in CA, she was the 25th person for that location according to sales. I think given the price, model 3 is great for people who commute and already have 2 cars (with the Tesla 3 replacing one of the ICE)

In my wife's case, she does about 50~70miles per day between work, pick up kid and (sometimes) family, and other stuff like groceries.

A Tesla 3 would be enough for her to cover 2-3 days of driving (assuming she forgets) and the space is more than plenty for groceries and a kid.

We are not giving up our ICE car, so that would stay for anything longer than the ~200miles range roundtrip.

And assuming she can get it fairly quickly, she might still qualify for about 10k USD in incentives from both fed and state gov. We see it as a great deal.

If the Tesla 3 goes well, we might get rid of ICE cars all together and just stick to rentals if we need to take a road trip.

[godwin]

Tesla's plugs are proprietary. Besides even if the plug is compatible, they can lock out others because there is also a software standard. They haven't done so yet, but it is an option available.


Is it a proprietary plug at Tesla charging stations? or does the system just not recognize non-Teslas and won't allow charge? I hope the other companies that jump in at the EV hype won't create proprietary stations.



yeah for employees/current owners
then next priority is US west coast...no word on Canada. If you didn't line-up or reserve the eve of the announcement I'd hazard a guess you won't get delivery until H2 2019. Don't forget that the X despite being a different beast was delayed twice by almost 2 years



I don't think there's any in Europe? just the one in Fremont and the gigafactory in Nevada that's not even fully operational yet. I think there's talks about opening another gigafactory in Japan

[thumper]

I wonder how much the 253K+ reservation has shocked the auto industry...just like when Apple introduced iphone 4, people went crazy, and every company jumped onto their boat to make something similar.

Toyota, GM, BMW, and Nissan Management would have been calling meetings like crazy these days.

I am the only person in the family who paid the reservation, the day it was announced I got 10+ message from my uncles and cousins asking whether they should wait or reserve one immediately. The actual numbers could be doubling or tripling.

can i ask you how much is the cost of electricity in HK? are there charging stations everywhere, or do you have to do it at home? is electricity generation from coal or nuclear power plant?

[asian_XL]

HK$1.1 per kilowatt hr = CAD18cents? it is double more expensive than in Canada.

there are 10 locations with superchargers in the city (the highest density in the world as per Musk said), and all of them require you to pay for the parking first in order to get your car charged up.

HK$8/hr to park ($1.4cad) x 1hr charging time VS. HK$40~50 ($7cad) charging it at home.

I believe it is coal, but who cares when the pollution from China is much worse

[thumper]

better bring a long extension cord.

Electric car boom drives surge in charging-station demand - Technology & Science - CBC News (http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/electric-car-charging-station-congestion-1.3518353)

[SkinnyPupp]

It's kind of a "hide the weenie" game for electric cars... They still use lots of fossil fuels in production (plastics, etc) and electricity isn't made for free especially in California they buy it from BC... And lithium batteries are absolute toxic nightmares.... I think the go green people are a little out to lunch nevermind the people trying to "save money on gas" by spending $55k+ on a new vehicle.
Ah, the old "petrol head" argument against EV from 15 years ago

[SkinnyPupp]

HK$1.1 per kilowatt hr = CAD18cents? it is double more expensive than in Canada.

there are 10 locations with superchargers in the city (the highest density in the world as per Musk said), and all of them require you to pay for the parking first in order to get your car charged up.

HK$8/hr to park ($1.4cad) x 1hr charging time VS. HK$40~50 ($7cad) charging it at home.

I believe it is coal, but who cares when the pollution from China is much worse
HK uses coal, gas, and diesel generators and also buys nuclear power from China

[Great68]

I would only buy an EV like the Model S or 3 if I had the capability to charge at home overnight.

Waiting 20+ minutes at a "charge station" is still unacceptable to me.

[MG1]

All EV's can charge overnight at home. They all come with a home charger.

[kkttsang]

All EV's can charge overnight at home. They all come with a home charger.

How much you think would cost for a full charge on the tesla 3 or even model s, if you charge at home overnight.

How much is it costing you?

[Timpo]

276,000 Tesla Model 3 pre-sold so far.

I bet it will surpass 300,000 pretty damn quickly.

276,000 Tesla Model 3 order deposits booked so far, Elon Musk says - Business - CBC News (http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/tesla-model-3-sales-numbers-1.3519422)

[Timpo]

I think the biggest success of Tesla here is not simply the technology itself, but design was the key.

Look at other EV/PHV vehicles.. Toyota Prius PHV, Chevy Volt, Mitsubishi iMiev, Nissan Leaf... none of these vehicle NEVER got raving reviews about their design. People kept saying they're weird look, look like cab, and all sorts of stuff.
Whereas Tesla vehicles look aesthetically pleasing and has high end American quality/image like Apple iPhone, Boeing 777, etc...

and for the price...who would choose other EV/PHV over Tesla?

[MG1]

How much you think would cost for a full charge on the tesla 3 or even model s, if you charge at home overnight.

How much is it costing you?

When I plugged in via 110, it was under two bucks. It all depends on your electricity bill..... I use a lot of electricity, so rates reflect that. Not sure if the 240 volt makes any difference.

When I first got the EV, I was being a typical frugal Asian........plugged in at Brentwood, TD bank, Ikea, Canadian Tire, Lougheed Mall, etc. and it cost me nothing, LOL. BTW, I drive like a moffo in the EV, so I use a lot of energy. Like an ICE, you use up more energy going fast. If I drive normally, it would be so much cheaper. If I drove around town normally and not floor it, I would not have to charge for three days.

When I go to Richmond and back to North Burnaby, the range meter goes down just under 20%. In the winter, it was 25%.


http://electricvehicles.caa.ca/electric-vehicle-cost-calculator/

[twitchyzero]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/innovations/wp/2016/04/04/the-car-industry-has-never-witnessed-what-tesla-is-about-to-go-through/

I'm trying to better understand the model 3 hype...it's just insane how it's disrupting the entire industry and it's not like there's marketing in the traditional sense. It just blew up through word of mouth/social media...and not just car people..across so many demographics.

If Tesla didn't exist, and BMW/Toyota/GM came up with a somewhat normal-looking EV at 35K, why wouldn't they likely garner the same attention?

[Timpo]

Tesla Model S can do 0-60mph in 2.8 seconds PogChamp

Tesla?s Model S Gets ?Ludicrous? Mode, Will Do 0-60 In 2.8 Seconds | TechCrunch (http://techcrunch.com/2015/07/17/teslas-model-s-gets-ludicrous-mode-will-do-0-60-in-2-8-seconds/)

It will blow all the European/Japanese luxury sedan in the dust. :yuno:
Including Audi RS4, Lexus GS-F, BMW M5, Mercedes AMG CLA 45, everything.

*edit* I was curious about what kind of power Tesla Model S has...here's the spec: 762 bhp, 687 ft·lb
http://techbakbak.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/tesla-car-self-parking-model-s.jpg
http://www.cartalk.com/sites/default/files/blogs/jim-motavalli/tesla%20model%20s%20sunset.jpg

[SkinnyPupp]

How much you think would cost for a full charge on the tesla 3 or even model s, if you charge at home overnight.

How much is it costing you?
The Model 3's 44 KWh battery charged from 0-44 in BC would cost around $5.46 CAD at the maximum tier

This gets you 215 miles

Sedans like the Accord are around 30 MPG. Gas in Vancouver is around $4.30 USD per gallon, so it would cost $30.80 USD [$40.33 CAD] in gas to drive 215 miles

[MG1]

Tesla Model S can do 0-60mph in 2.8 seconds PogChamp

Tesla?s Model S Gets ?Ludicrous? Mode, Will Do 0-60 In 2.8 Seconds | TechCrunch (http://techcrunch.com/2015/07/17/teslas-model-s-gets-ludicrous-mode-will-do-0-60-in-2-8-seconds/)

It will blow all the European/Japanese luxury sedan in the dust. :yuno:
Including Audi RS4, Lexus GS-F, BMW M5, Mercedes AMG CLA 45, everything.



You just found this out?

[Galactic_Phantom]

It will blow all the European/Japanese luxury sedan in the dust. :yuno:
Including Audi RS4, Lexus GS-F, BMW M5, Mercedes AMG CLA 45, everything.


yenno....except on a track, or anywhere else with turns...

You just found this out?

Timpo gon' Timp

[Timpo]

yenno....except on a track, or anywhere else with turns...

I don't know about track but it's definitely impressive.

Also those luxury sedans will most likely spend their time on street than track.

According to Road & Track, the Model S did 0.91g on their skidpad testing...it also has 0.24 Cd rating.

[scoobyej20]

Here's some videos for you Timpo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9cA1doO_9h8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e-jquwHKtI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4JEpksZA0JA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cv3zYzl0kMQ

[Timpo]

Here's some videos for you Timpo.

So basically Ferrari and Lambo suck at launch and only good for top speed.
Whereas Tesla is opposite.

It's still impressive that you need those super expensive exotic cars to compare with electric sedan.

I'm quite confident that Tesla will improve at faster rate than petro powered vehicle.

This is going to be similar to trains.
Steam locomotives were better than electric trains...as technology advanced, electric trains quickly surpassed steam locomotives.

[scoobyej20]

a picture (dyno graph) is better than a thousand words.

Dyno Graph of P85D. Can't find a P90D dyno graph yet.

http://www.dragtimes.com/images_dyno/27143-2015-Tesla-Model-S-Dyno.jpg

[asian_XL]

People had enough with the expensive gas price, period

If gas isn't 1 to 1.6 a litre, but 75 cents i will not ordera Tesla.

[SkinnyPupp]

It won't be long before you'd have to be insane to buy a normal every day car containing an internal combustion engine. It will just be silly... Those types of vehicles will eventually be relegated to niche markets, and eventually for nostalgia purposes only. Self-driving will be an option similar to air conditioning today - not on every car, but pretty much the first 'luxury' to get.

After that, people will look back at these dirty, noisy things and look at them the same way we look at horse and buggies today. Sure they will always be fun to ride, but so are horses.

[godwin]

$5-10 (depend on which level you are using at home)

Home charger cord takes forever to charge.. For best performance you need the DC inverter which is about $5000 installed.

How much you think would cost for a full charge on the tesla 3 or even model s, if you charge at home overnight.

How much is it costing you?

[kkttsang]

$5-10 (depend on which level you are using at home)

Home charger cord takes forever to charge.. For best performance you need the DC inverter which is about $5000 installed.

Without the DC inverter, how long will it take. 8 hrs? Or more?

[godwin]

Depends on which S model you have (ie battery size).. I would say 8 hours minimum.. they all say "over night"

Without the DC inverter, how long will it take. 8 hrs? Or more?

[Hondaracer]

Family friend who owns the model S was telling me he gets an 80% charge in 2.5 hours with the home kit?

[Bender Unit]

Is the home charging kit include or extra accessories ?

[thumper]

Is the home charging kit include or extra accessories ?

Tesla ? Model S (http://shop.teslamotors.com/collections/model-s)

[Timpo]

I don't know if Tesla is going to be able to keep up with other companies though. I know Asian companies in particular, are very good at this.

Apple introduced iPhone, which is the base of all smart phones we have.
Then Samsung, LG, Sony, etc...have been doing pretty good job competing against iPhone.

There will always be core fan of Tesla, just like iPhone...but other companies will improve too.
Combustion engine will keep disappearing, just like flip phones kept disappearing.

[Verdasco]

I don't know if Tesla is going to be able to keep up with other companies though. I know Asian companies in particular, are very good at this.

Apple introduced iPhone, which is the base of all smart phones we have.
Then Samsung, LG, Sony, etc...have been doing pretty good job competing against iPhone.

There will always be core fan of Tesla, just like iPhone...but other companies will improve too.
Combustion engine will keep disappearing, just like flip phones kept disappearing.

10/10 troll post, would read again

ResidentSleeper

[Timpo]

10/10 troll post, would read again

ResidentSleeper

or who knows, maybe Tesla will just keep dominating the EV market

[thumper]

keep in mind, on the other side of the world... BYD and their plug-in hybrids dominate the chinese market, and does have some sort of market presence in europe.

(plug-in hybrid taxi in spain... isn't that an old toyota corolla?):

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bf/Bilbao_05_2012_BYD_F3DM_2447.JPGhttps://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/46/Bilbao_05_2012_BYD_F3DM_2438.JPG

BYD Expects Its Electric Car Sales To Triple This Year (http://insideevs.com/byd-expects-its-electric-car-sales-to-triple-this-year/)


Bloomberg reports that BYD could triple its plug-in electric car sales in China this year.

A market that Bloomberg can’t help but note is apparently “coveted by Tesla“, and that for 2016 has withdrawn a target of 10,000 sales moving back to 5,000. A number that BYD can eat up in less than a month.

In 2015, BYD sold some 58,000 plug-in cars (e5, e6, Qin, Tang, etc.) and the company expects that this year it could increase to 150,000 – a number similar to the total amount of plug-ins that will be sold in the US in 2016.

Through the end of February, BYD was still just less than 10,000 plug-ins sold, so 140,000 more to go in the next 10 months. (Of note: The first quarter in China is notoriously slow, last year about 1/3rd of Q4 volumes)

“BYD may sell as many as 150,000 new-energy vehicles this year, compared with the 58,000 it delivered in 2015, Chairman Wang Chuanfu said at a briefing in Hong Kong. The company surged the most in more than five months in intraday trading in Hong Kong after predicting first-quarter profit may rise more than 50 percent from a year earlier.”

Big bump for BYD is nearly sevenfold increase in net income in 2015 compared to 2014.

“BYD, which counts Buffett’s Berkshire Hathaway Inc. as a shareholder, reported full-year net income rose almost sevenfold to 2.82 billion yuan ($433 million) from a year earlier.”

they are not sexy, possibly death traps, but their products are affordable for the unwashed masses won't don't care about how many g's it can pull on the skidpad or "ludicrous speed"...

https://youtu.be/ygE01sOhzz0

but if they start really going full EV/zero emissions and still be low cost....

http://www.byd.com/la/auto/e6.html

http://cleantechnica.com/files/2014/10/BYD-e6-Beijing.jpg

we might all be in these things, and hopefully won't go up in flames like those counterfeit hoverboards :o

[jasonturbo]

Sure it might only cost xx$ for a full charge now, ask yourself what energy costs will look like once 5% of the vehicles on the road are EV, and then 10% etc etc

Right now, today, is probably the best time possible to own an EV, electricity costs are only going up, and a strong jump in demand will of course result in a strong increase in price. The additional demand for electricity will affect not just your utility bill but will also impact the cost of all goods and services. Interesting to wonder how the cost of electricity at supercharger stations may eventually mimic the peaks and valleys of conventional ICE fuels.

I'm all for the EV's though, if I did any commuting I would have one already.

I do wonder though, is the EV basically the DVD video of transportation, will it be a 5-10 year period before blue ray (hydrogen) inevitably takes over.

[thumper]

I do wonder though, is the EV basically the DVD video of transportation, will it be a 5-10 year period before blue ray (hydrogen) inevitably takes over.

or we be flyin' (hopefully):

https://trcs.wikispaces.com/file/view/23719_w.jpg/53020754/23719_w.jpg

[scoobyej20]

I think battery tech will dramatically advance in the next 10-20 years.

Charging times will be significantly faster, cost of battery will decrease.

Range anxiety will be a thing of the past, charging stations will be everywhere. Inductive charging will be the standard for all EV cars.

check out this video from Nissan.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLs7YOjC2mE

Sure it might only cost xx$ for a full charge now, ask yourself what energy costs will look like once 5% of the vehicles on the road are EV, and then 10% etc etc

Right now, today, is probably the best time possible to own an EV, electricity costs are only going up, and a strong jump in demand will of course result in a strong increase in price. The additional demand for electricity will affect not just your utility bill but will also impact the cost of all goods and services. Interesting to wonder how the cost of electricity at supercharger stations may eventually mimic the peaks and valleys of conventional ICE fuels.

I'm all for the EV's though, if I did any commuting I would have one already.

I do wonder though, is the EV basically the DVD video of transportation, will it be a 5-10 year period before blue ray (hydrogen) inevitably takes over.

[scoobyej20]

Nice video of Tesla Model S being put together.

from sheet metal to finished product.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VxL3GtDE22M

[Hondaracer]

or who knows, maybe Tesla will just keep dominating the EV market

They are too far behind with their supply route already imo

like i said, it's more likely they provide other major manufacturers with batteries down the road than they become one of the big 3/4 auto makers.

[asian_XL]

BYD EV is a massive fail. We have 30 something BYD EV taxi in HK and taxi drivers are regretting as the battery isnt keeping the charge after a year. Some taxi claimed it needed to be recharged every 2 hrs in city, not practical and efficient as advertised.

[Timpo]

They are too far behind with their supply route already imo

like i said, it's more likely they provide other major manufacturers with batteries down the road than they become one of the big 3/4 auto makers.
Does Toyota still own Tesla?

I think Toyota bought Tesla a while ago in hopes to get Tesla technology for Toyota hybrids.

[Nlkko]

What do you mean own. It's a public company still, nobody bought it. Majority of shares are owned by institutions. Toyota might have bought a small stake (and reportedly sold it) in the past. It never own Tesla.

[ancient_510]

Interesting to wonder how the cost of electricity at supercharger stations may eventually mimic the peaks and valleys of conventional ICE fuels.

It won't in BC unless the current laws change.
British Columbia Hydro and Power Authority Electric Tariff (https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/documents/corporate/tariff-filings/electric-tariff/bchydro-electric-tariff.pdf)

If a Customer wishes to sell Electricity which the Customer has purchased from BC Hydro to a tenant of that Customer on the same Premises on a metered basis, then the Customer shall agree that the selling price for such Electricity shall not exceed the price which BC Hydro would have charged had that tenant been a Customer of BC Hydro.

That means the rate can't fluctuate regularly because what BC Hydro charges is regulated by the BC Utilities Commission. Nor can the EV charger owner make a profit from selling electricity.

[tiger_handheld]

It won't in BC unless the current laws change.
British Columbia Hydro and Power Authority Electric Tariff (https://www.bchydro.com/content/dam/BCHydro/customer-portal/documents/corporate/tariff-filings/electric-tariff/bchydro-electric-tariff.pdf)

If a Customer wishes to sell Electricity which the Customer has purchased from BC Hydro to a tenant of that Customer on the same Premises on a metered basis, then the Customer shall agree that the selling price for such Electricity shall not exceed the price which BC Hydro would have charged had that tenant been a Customer of BC Hydro.

That means the rate can't fluctuate regularly because what BC Hydro charges is regulated by the BC Utilities Commission. Nor can the EV charger owner make a profit from selling electricity.


That sounds nice in theory...

[SkinnyPupp]

They can't charge for electricity but they can charge for the parking space to attain the electricity!

[scoobyej20]

here Timpo.

Why the Tesla-Toyota Partnership Short-Circuited - Bloomberg (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-08-07/tesla-toyota-deal-to-develop-electric-suv-fizzles)

Does Toyota still own Tesla?

I think Toyota bought Tesla a while ago in hopes to get Tesla technology for Toyota hybrids.

[asian_XL]

https://www.teslamotors.com/blog/the-week-electric-vehicles-went-mainstream?utm_campaign=Blog_Model3_040716&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=social

We’ve now received more than 325,000 reservations, which corresponds to about $14 billion in implied future sales, making this the single biggest one-week launch of any product ever.

[thumper]

https://youtu.be/3ipRpWs7CaY

[yray]

Inb4 Kickstarter F up

[twitchyzero]

that's a lie...harry potter books sold 15M day one :derp:

[Nlkko]

300k + reservation now. Probably hit a mil by end of next year. Elon can already get a capital loan worth 14 billion based on that 300k list, based entirely on promises without having to give up equities. They are geniuses.

[ancient_510]

They can't charge for electricity but they can charge for the parking space to attain the electricity!

This. Exactly.

There is nothing stopping a lot owner from having free unserviced spots and paid EV charging spots.

Nor is there anything stopping them from having two prices, one for unserviced and the other for EV charging availability.

The only thing that cannot happen (with BC's current laws) for "transient stays" (ie. only stopping in for a quick charge and then moving on) is billing per kWh consumed by your car charging.

[Harvey Specter]

It kinda reminds of a smaller Panamera...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jB5c2JdPakI

[tiger_handheld]

300k + reservation now. Probably hit a mil by end of next year. Elon can already get a capital loan worth 14 billion based on that 300k list, based entirely on promises without having to give up equities. They are geniuses.

you realize the $1000 deposits are refundable right? No bank is ever going to fund a loan based on refundable deposits. I bet Tesla knows this too...
It's like when FB went IPO, everyone and their friken grandma bought in... even on this thread we had couple of people post up their "confirmed orders" screenshot.... lets see in 2 years how many average joes will be driving a C$60,000 car excluding taxes, when people are already bitching about a place to live...

[Nlkko]

you realize the $1000 deposits are refundable right? No bank is ever going to fund a loan based on refundable deposits. I bet Tesla knows this too...
It's like when FB went IPO, everyone and their friken grandma bought in... even on this thread we had couple of people post up their "confirmed orders" screenshot.... lets see in 2 years how many average joes will be driving a C$60,000 car excluding taxes, when people are already bitching about a place to live...

Actually you can take that order book/list to banks and PE firms and get capital loan.... That's a fact I would invite you to research and confirm it yourself. This is why this guy (Elon Musk) PR skill is next level. People raving about Steve Jobs and his marketing prowess, Elon is up there with him and he doesn't even speak fluent English.

Your argument about people withdrawing their orders based on these assumptions:
1. They can't afford RE.
2. They don't own any RE already.
3. They can't afford a 35k USD car.
4. They are the average Joes.

And to your comment on FB. FB is presently one of the best growth prospects in the Tech sector. Any portfolio manager don't have FB deserve to get fired. It was a great prospect when it IPO, it is a great prospect now.

[tiger_handheld]

Actually you can take that order book/list to banks and PE firms and get capital loan.... That's a fact I would invite you to research and confirm it yourself. This is why this guy (Elon Musk) PR skill is next level. People raving about Steve Jobs and his marketing prowess, Elon is up there with him and he doesn't even speak fluent English.

Your argument about people withdrawing their orders based on these assumptions:
1. They can't afford RE.
2. They don't own any RE already.
3. They can't afford a 35k USD car.
4. They are the average Joes.

And to your comment on FB. FB is presently one of the best growth prospects in the Tech sector. Any portfolio manager don't have FB deserve to get fired. It was a great prospect when it IPO, it is a great prospect now.

the 3 was suppose to be a mass market car..for the average joe. In the US it makes sense, 35k car, less at least 7k in rebates from Fed/State programs and now you are at Honda Civic levels. That's pretty affordable... in the US.

But what about globally? what about in Canada? what about in GVRD? A $60,000 car is only affordable to part of the population... A true mass market car is like a Honda Civic (what do they start at 20-25k for base model?)...As much as I love Tesla, it's a lot of hype right now... but only time will tell.

And this is no different from FB because, when it IPO'ed there was so much hype, then a week or so later, it tanked below IPO and it took several weeks/months to stabilize. When people realize they have given Elon a 2 year interest free loan for $1000usd or use it to fund a trip to Disney with the kids.... minds will change. Unless of course you are retired after selling your South Van home for 2mil above asking.

And to your point on getting loans, maybe they will get 25% of the value of the PO, but definitely no where close to say 80-100%.

[Digitalis]

Your really dating yourself with the civic comment as the common car as they have climbed the ladder and are far from it.
Today i'd say your looking more at american/korean base cars at 15k

[asian_XL]

Some say...the Chinese BYD has higher potential to be the king of EV.

http://arabitec.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/New-BYD-Qin-EV300-2016-777x365.jpg
http://www.ecars.bg/images/stories/2016/apr/byd-ev300.jpg
http://images.hgmsites.net/med/byd-qin-ev300_100551535_m.jpg

if you attempt to lower the car, the battery will hit the ground and burst into flame...it's call the EV300
http://www.carnewschina.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/byd-ev300-china-6.jpg?756232

[Marshall Placid]

For those interested in the financial aspects of the deposits:

At the splashy reveal event for the Model 3 EV, Tesla Motors unveiled the car but little other information about it. Having outlined the basics—that the car will start at $35,000, seat five, and offer two- or all-wheel drive—details about the car’s battery pack, power system, and more were held back for release at a later date. As it turns out, that later date was this past Sunday afternoon, two days after the official Model 3 reveal, when Tesla CEO Elon Musk took a few moments to respond to the public’s questions on Twitter.

In multiple tweets, Musk clarified both the Model 3’s standard and optional drive systems, as well as how many pre-orders the company already has for the car. Speaking to the Model 3’s standard drive configuration, Musk said it will use a single electric motor (as does the Model S sedan) powering the rear wheels; the optional setup will also mimic that on the Model S, which is to say it’ll use an extra electric motor to also power the front wheels. Horsepower and torque figures, alas, remain elusive, and Musk made several bizarre statements regarding the Model 3’s steering system, describing the production unit as “feeling like a spaceship.” The outlook is rosier (and more down to earth) on the order bank side of things, where Elon claims Tesla has received more than 276,000 pre-orders for the Model 3 globally.

Naturally, online (where not everyone with an opinion has studied Business Accounting 101, or even basic arithmetic) there has been some confusion as to the monetary value of those orders. Allow us to clear that up. Each pre-order customer puts down a $1000, refundable deposit to reserve a Model 3. Simple math returns an immediate yield for Tesla of $276 million, not the billions of dollars that some—including Mr. Musk, again via Twitter—have touted. Any figure using the “b” word counts the value of those orders as final sales. (Multiplying the Model 3’s $35K base price by the current number of reservations nets Tesla a still-theoretical $9.6 billion, although Musk tweeted $7.5 billion, assuming a $42K average transaction price and an earlier, smaller, figure for the total number of reservations.) Some have breathlessly described such billions as a windfall for Tesla before it has delivered a single Model 3. However, neither we nor Tesla see its deposit money that way. The automaker is adamant that the $1000 deposits aren’t counted as revenue until after a customer actually takes delivery of a car (the deposit represents an initial payment against the eventual purchase price of a Model 3). And deliveries happen only after customers receive purchase agreements and configure their cars, steps that eager Model 3 reservationists are still waiting to take. Tesla, for its part, has promised that the first Model 3s will be delivered late next year.

So what does $276 million in deposits mean to Tesla’s balance sheet? Until the day that it eventually starts being converted to revenue, i.e. when sales commence—if those sales commence—it’s both a cash asset and an offsetting liability. According to Tesla’s past SEC filings—and as confirmed by a company representative—deposit money is not counted as revenue, but is lumped into the company’s cash holdings. The caveat is that deposits (in total) are specified in a separate line under “liabilities” on the company balance sheet. Ergo, customer deposits can and likely will be used for, say, helping launch the Model 3 or for general operating expenses (just as deposits for the Model S and Model X were), while the sum of deposits on undelivered cars remains listed as debt on the balance sheet—it’s not Tesla’s revenue until it receives it in exchange for an actual car.

2018 Tesla Model 3 Photos and Info: A Small Electric Car that Makes a Big Noise
Tesla Model 3 Orders Open March 31, Company Lost $889 Million in 2015
Tesla Model S Research: Full Pricing, Specs, Reviews, and More
But wait, what if all of those consumers asked for their money back or Tesla, for some reason, couldn’t fulfill its obligation to deliver cars? That would be an issue, but likely not a debilitating one. Unlike many other start-up car companies we’ve seen over the years, Tesla is not so under-capitalized that these deposits represent a majority of its assets. As of December 31, 2015, Tesla had $1.2 billion in “cash and cash equivalents.” Furthermore, Tesla’s been down this road before, only with less fanfare. Tesla’s annual SEC filing, as of December 31, 2015 showed it already held $283 million in customer deposits, most of which ostensibly were for the still-fresh Model X crossover. Of course, there were fewer reservations for the Model X than for the 3—hence it avoided the sort of frenzy and speculative discussion that has surrounded the Model 3 order process—but the deposit total for that car was greater because would-be customers needed to shell out $5000 to get in that line. So long story short, even though Model 3 deposits are assumed to have inflated Tesla’s cash and liability figures an equal amount, even before the 3’s order books opened the company had more than enough cash on hand (plus other assets) to draw from should it need to meet refund obligations.
Tesla CEO Clarifies Model 3 Features, Reservation Tally Via Twitter ? News ? Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog (http://blog.caranddriver.com/tesla-ceo-clarifies-model-3-features-reservation-tally-via-twitter-we-explain-what-happens-to-all-that-deposit-money/)

[thumper]

Does Toyota still own Tesla?

I think Toyota bought Tesla a while ago in hopes to get Tesla technology for Toyota hybrids.

Unplugged: Toyota Axing RAV4 EV, Won't Renew Tesla Deal ? News ? Car and Driver | Car and Driver Blog (http://blog.caranddriver.com/unplugged-toyota-axing-rav4-ev-wont-renew-tesla-deal/)

[m4k4v4li]

..

[thumper]

https://youtu.be/TIh2PjqfXkQ

[Marshall Placid]

Just read this article today.

Very interesting:

Tesla: Model 3 Could Put Elon Musk Out of Business, Hedge Fund Warns (http://fortune.com/2016/12/02/tesla-model-3-stock-elon-musk/)


Tesla has to double the Model 3’s advertised price or it will lose tons of money, he says.
Tesla Motors customers are lining up to wait as much as two years to own the company’s eagerly anticipated cheaper electric car, the Model 3. But while the new car has created a lot of buzz for Tesla TSLA -0.23% , one high-performing hedge fund manger says the Model 3 will end up being a total wreck for the company. In fact, he says it will likely put Tesla out of business. Put another way: His price target for Tesla’s stock: $0.

Mark Spiegel, founder of hedge fund Stanphyl Capital Partners, says the Model 3—which Tesla CEO Elon Musk has promised to sell for as little as $35,000—may put Tesla on a path to bankruptcy before it even comes out.

Speaking at the Robin Hood Investors Conference this week, Spiegel laid out his case in a 152-slide presentation on why he is shorting, i.e. betting against, Tesla stock. Factor in the debt, and he thinks the car company is worth less than zero. “I continue to believe that it’s the market’s biggest single-company stock bubble,” Spiegel elaborated in his November letter to investors, obtained by Fortune.

That so-called bubble deflated a bit after Spiegel’s presentation Tuesday morning, with Tesla stock falling more than 3% by the end of the day, while the broader market rose. Tesla shares fell another 4% Thursday after Spiegel’s presentation from the conference (which was closed to the media) was shared publicly.

Spiegel’s Stanphyl Capital manages $9 million. While that’s tiny in comparison to other hedge funds whose managers also presented at Robin Hood, from Jeff Smith’s Starboard Value to David Einhorn’s Greenlight Capital, Stanphyl’s assets have quintupled since Spiegel launched the fund about five years ago. This year, the fund has returned nearly 35% through November.

It isn’t the first time that a hedge fund short-seller has publicly attacked Tesla recently. Jim Chanos, the Kynikos Associates investor who lucratively shorted Enron before its scandalous demise, said in September that he is also shorting Tesla, believing the company is doomed, particularly after its controversial merger with SolarCity SCTY -0.29% is completed. Tesla’s stock price is down about 25% in 2016 so far.

But while other Tesla critics have emphasized the company’s rapid cash bleed; recent controversy over crashes seemingly related to drivers’ use of its autopilot feature; and conflicts of interest with SolarCity, of which Musk is chairman and his cousin is CEO, Spiegel focused on a different problem for Tesla.

The prospect of a $35,000 “mass-market” Tesla Model 3—much more affordable compared to Tesla’s other vehicles, which cost at least twice as much—is the “real reason” investors have bought into Tesla’s stock, Spiegel said at the conference Tuesday. But “that will never happen,” asserts Spiegel. That’s because at that price Tesla would be selling the Model 3 at “a gigantic loss”—indeed, it could lose nearly as much on each car as the price customers are paying for it, Spiegel estimates.

Here’s how he got there, by the numbers:

In Tesla’s latest quarter, it reported a $22 million surprise profit, its first in years. But much of the boost came from a one-off sale of government subsidy credits for electric vehicles that Tesla had been collecting. Without that, the company actually lost $117 million in the third quarter—or a loss of $4,710 per car.
Each car Tesla currently sells costs $81,000 to build, Spiegel estimates. Those cars are currently profitable on their own (excluding leased cars and other unrelated company expenses)—but they sell at an average of $105,900, a price point that’s only affordable for a higher-income segment of consumers.
In order to sell the Model 3 at as low a price as $35,000 and still make a profit, Tesla would have to cut its production costs by more than half.
Where will Tesla find all those savings? The company hasn’t said specifically, but Spiegel estimates that it can cut about $6,000 off the $81,000-per-car cost by using its new batteries produced at its so-called gigafactory (which also cost $5 billion to build), another $5,000 by using cheaper parts for the Model 3—substituting steel for aluminum, for example—and $5,000 on top of that by finding ways to make its manufacturing more efficient (perhaps with greater automation). Still, that only brings the cost to build each Model 3 down to $65,000, much more than Tesla plans to sell it for. But Spiegel gives Musk some benefit of the doubt, and allows for what the investor calls a “cost savings fudge factor” that’s “extremely generous” and “probably undeserved” but which could knock off as much as $15,000 or so off the cost—bringing the cost per Model 3 down to just under $50,000, say $48,000 at the lowest.
While Tesla has said the Model 3 will be available for as little as $35,000, Musk has predicted that the average sales price of the car will be $43,000, once customers add various upgrades and features. At that price and a minimum of $48,000 in costs per car, Tesla would lose at least $5,000 for every Model 3 it sells.


The obvious solution? Tesla needs to raise the price of the Model 3—to at least $50,000 for a bare-bones model, or 43% higher than the price currently promised, Spiegel predicts. “I wouldn’t be surprised if Musk claims a $35,000 base price but then never delivers any even CLOSE to that number,” Spiegel tells Fortune in an email.

It wouldn’t be the first time Tesla hiked the base price of one of its cars after promising it would be lower. When Tesla began delivering initial orders of its Model S electric sedan in June 2012, it sold them at a base price of $57,400. Just five months later, however, Tesla raised the car’s starting price to $59,900. About four months after that, though, Tesla cancelled the lowest-end Model S version, making the car’s new starting price $10,000 higher, at $69,000—20% higher than the low price it initially teased.

Yet with the “mass-market” Model 3, selling the car for more could be just as fatal a sentence for Tesla as selling it at a loss. If Tesla raised the base price of the car to $50,000 or more, as Spiegel expects, the Model 3 would no longer be competitive with the many other electric cars that will be on the market by then—as the Model 3 won’t start shipping to customers until the end of next year, and likely not before the end of 2018 for most orders, analysts predict.

For example, at a price of $50,000, the Model 3 would be about 33% more expensive than the cheapest Chevy Bolt, an electric car from GM GM -2.80% that’s already on the market starting at $37,495 at select dealerships—more than a year (or two) earlier than the Model 3.

And the higher the price of the Model 3 goes, the more Musk’s dream of a cheap and affordable Tesla disappears. And without that mainstream demand, Spiegel thinks Tesla’s future doesn’t look so bright at all.

Tesla did not immediately respond to a request for comment.



TLDR:

Quote: "Tesla needs to raise the price of the Model 3—to at least $50,000 for a bare-bones model, or 43% higher than the price currently promised, Spiegel predicts. “I wouldn’t be surprised if Musk claims a $35,000 base price but then never delivers any even CLOSE to that number."

and:

"While Tesla has said the Model 3 will be available for as little as $35,000, Musk has predicted that the average sales price of the car will be $43,000, once customers add various upgrades and features. At that price and a minimum of $48,000 in costs per car, Tesla would lose at least $5,000 for every Model 3 it sells."

[asian_XL]

VW is pushing its e-golf to have 200km range
BMW is also adding range to its i3 and you should see EV Mini pretty soon. I believe the Leaf gets larger battery in 2016 already.

In Asia and Europe, the Renault Zoe is now 200km EV. MB has the EV B-class on the road already.

$35000 Model 3 should be pretty basic, mostly like the 60D basic. I assume most people ordering it is expecting to pay 40k+ as we all know Tesla options aren't really that cheap. For me, I am expecting to pay 45K+ for the dual motor model. Anything fancy like the glass roof or large rims or biochemical filter is only a luxury thing.

I heard Musk is building battery plants in China or somewhere in Europe, hope that will lower the building cost.

[threezero]

Agree that TSLA is the biggest single company stock bubble. Remember all the facebook post and twitter about TSLA going to the moon when it was at its peak at 280??? everyone on social media is so sure its going past 300$

TSLA is a triple digit penny stock.

[Hehe]

From an investor perspective, I'm not so sure TSLA is going under.

The reason lies behind the gigafactory that TSLA owns. TSLA is not betting on becoming a dominant player in the car industry, but rather the absolute requirement of EV: batteries.

By pricing Model 3 at or near its cost (assuming it's not willing to lose huge amount of money), it creates the economy of scale it needs to sustain such a gigantic battery production. Furthermore, it's betting that by doing so, it would attract major players in car industry to join suit (which it's clear that it's having effect)... and it would benefit itself as a major battery producer down the road.

Panasonic/Tesla collaboration already positioned themselves as the largest battery producer in the world. Its single production is roughly no.2~4 combined. If all vehicles were to switch to EV based, it's in a great spot.

If you look at TSLA products and acquisitions, you can see that it's not looking to expand in car industry, but rather additional usages of its batteries. Solar City is a great example: you can generate whatever amount of electricity... but you ultimately need somewhere to store it - TSLA batteries.

Full disclosure: I have no TSLA position and no plan on doing so.

[DragonChi]

Chevy Bolt is going to be around 30,000 USD. After tax incentives.

Apparently Chevy is losing 9,000 per vehicle.

It's got decent range at ~230 miles.

I think they're pretty aggressive on this to get market share, whatever that means. Good news for the consumer though :)

[Manic!]

All Tesla vehicles produced starting next year will be able to go full autonomous by 2018. They will also have there own version of Uber that will be fully autonomous using customers cars. That has the possibility to make them tons of money. So they can sell the cars at cost and still turn a profit. They have also already banned people from using there autonomous cars for Uber.

[Kilinim]

Tempted to put a deposit on a 3...anybody else have one in?

[Hehe]

Tempted to put a deposit on a 3...anybody else have one in?

Yes, have one from day 1. But even that we are not expecting to receive in the first batch. :pokerface:

[ravenhill]

All Tesla vehicles produced starting next year will be able to go full autonomous by 2018. They will also have there own version of Uber that will be fully autonomous using customers cars. That has the possibility to make them tons of money. So they can sell the cars at cost and still turn a profit. They have also already banned people from using there autonomous cars for Uber.

And what makes this a guarantee? I'm not doubting that the technology will one day be achievable. But in a couple years? Sounds to me like yet another grandiose Tesla claim.

[Manic!]

And what makes this a guarantee? I'm not doubting that the technology will one day be achievable. But in a couple years? Sounds to me like yet another grandiose Tesla claim.

Because the technology already exists.

https://www.google.com/selfdrivingcar/where/
https://techcrunch.com/2016/11/21/nutonomy-boston/
https://www.wired.com/2016/10/ubers-self-driving-truck-makes-first-delivery-50000-beers/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTrgRYa2wbI

Watch the first minute
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzKnk2S90tw
George Hotz' Self-Driving Car Project Code Is Now Available Online : Auto News : Auto World News (http://www.autoworldnews.com/articles/24237/20161203/george-hotz-self-drving-car-project-code-is-now-available-online.htm)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8PR5wKT9VA

and Apple is ?excited? about the potential of self-driving cars | Ars Technica (http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/12/apple-is-excited-about-the-potential-of-self-driving-cars/)

[ravenhill]

Ah yes, George Hotz, who apparently recently quit his plan to sell his "$999 autonomous driving upgrade kit" once safety regulators started making inquiries. In his words, “Would much rather spend my life building amazing tech than dealing with regulators and lawyers."

Sounds like reliable and safe autonomous car technology for sure.

....But wait! He's apparently now released some self-driving software. Oh, hang on, according to him: “We’re not shipping a product.... We’re shipping alpha software really for research purposes only. We do not provide any guarantees.”

Okay. :pokerface:

The technology for autonomous vehicles happily and safely negotiating city streets, in all weather conditions, is "here" in the same way the technology for VR is "here". It's within our grasp, but still relatively rudimentary. All I see in those articles are phrases like "begin testing" and technology staying "only on the highway, where it doesn’t have to deal with tricky variables".

[Manic!]

Well for claims they will have a car buy 2021.

https://media.ford.com/content/fordmedia/fna/us/en/news/2016/08/16/ford-targets-fully-autonomous-vehicle-for-ride-sharing-in-2021.html

Same goes for BMW.
https://www.wired.com/2016/07/bmws-bold-plan-make-fully-self-driving-car-2021/

[ravenhill]

Sure, I won't deny it, who knows what will happen. Of course, it's not like auto manufacturers have ever given rosy predictions of launch dates or anything...

And let's not forget that according to Google in 2012, we should pretty much be in autonomous cars by now:

https://www.cnet.com/news/googles-sergey-brin-youll-ride-in-robot-cars-within-5-years/

[Mr.Money]

Tempted to put a deposit on a 3...anybody else have one in?


Yes, have one from day 1. But even that we are not expecting to receive in the first batch. :pokerface:

that's bullshit,wonder how much interest their making in the bank with everyone's fee.

[twitchyzero]

glad i didn't put down a deposit...almost got hyped into being an early adopter though

by the time it's actually widely available in Canada I'm almost sure there will be other players with competitive offerings.

[dlo]

glad i didn't put down a deposit...almost got hyped into being an early adopter though

by the time it's actually widely available in Canada I'm almost sure there will be other players with competitive offerings.

exactly the reason why i sold my deposit to a friend lol, by the time it comes out, theres probably gonna be electric cars with better range/more options, the tesla is sick but its gonna take way too long...

[freakshow]

Model 3 passed all regulatory requirements for production two weeks ahead of schedule. Expecting to complete SN1 on Friday
my body is ready

[thumper]

https://youtu.be/vzT0uNT0ds8

[!Aznboi128]

the interior looks a lot better than I had anticipated

[Nlkko]

Agree that TSLA is the biggest single company stock bubble. Remember all the facebook post and twitter about TSLA going to the moon when it was at its peak at 280??? everyone on social media is so sure its going past 300$

TSLA is a triple digit penny stock.

The stock has 2x from this post which was 7 months ago ��

Love the new video, find me a CEO/ President of a multi billion dollar company that can speak about their product like this guy.

But of course you can wait until 2021 to buy a Ford ������

[BaoTurbo]

I got a buddy that wants to back out and hes in the 300ish spot. Anybody know if the deposits can change names or maybe different owner name when purchase time comes at the very least?

[twitchyzero]

i had considered scalping them
but they're not transferrable

[BaoTurbo]

i had considered scalping them
but they're not transferrable

Smart man :smug:

Yea I was considering flipping it in the end if Tesla doesn't deliver either lol :lol:

[asma123]

I got a buddy that wants to back out and hes in the 300ish spot. Anybody know if the deposits can change names or maybe different owner name when purchase time comes at the very least?

I'd consider buying it off him if he wants. Any idea which one he ordered?

[Gerbs]

How do you check you your spot number?!?

[twitchyzero]

haha what the fuck, using the tablet interface to open the glove compartment?
the Model 3 actually isn't filmed in this video...just dont want to disappoint anyone hoping to see it in the 11 min video (he's sitting in his model S i think)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MgzwBW_LPdE

[asian_XL]

EPA report on the long range Model 3:

Charge Depleting Range (Calculated miles) 495.11 WutFace

https://www3.epa.gov/otaq/datafiles/CSI-HTSLV00.0L13.PDF

[twitchyzero]

interior/exterior tour

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Gy50Y_tZys

[gilly]

https://streamable.com/hb68a

infotainment interface for model 3

[asian_XL]

I hope it can go on revscene while driving.

[Jmac]

No auto sensing windshield wipers? Fuck, my 87 Nissan had that FFS

[UnknownJinX]

No auto sensing windshield wipers? Fuck, my 87 Nissan had that FFSWhy do you like it?

Most people actually hate it. The problem is simply that they don't work that great. Very finnicky stuff that works whenever it wants, and you get shafted if you have to replace the windshield. I'd rather have the manual control ones; I mean, are we really that lazy to manually control a knob?

[asian_XL]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DT0vDMWsq4

[european]

I can't wait! It's going to be great!

[asian_XL]

the door and trunk hinges scare me.

[twitchyzero]

wonder if traditional mfgr like bmw toyota gm will also make elec vehicles 99% controlled through the console even for basic functions ie. wipers, glove box etc.

[originalhypa]

i want something that has at the very least 300 mile range because you have to remember batteries will start holding less and less charge.

Along with that, the more you use the go pedal, the more yoru usage drops. One of my buddies took his Model X to Penticton this weekend and had to stop twice to charge it. Apparently 150kmh, while smooth on the Coq, really drains the batteries.

That said, he hit the charging station in Hope, another in Merritt, and was able to park right in front of his hotel leaving his X plugged in overnight.

It's a pretty amazing vehicle though. I was really impressed with it's tech, fit, and finish.

[thumper]

What is the anticipated insurance rates for the model 3?

[UnknownJinX]

Watched bits of the video.

I still don't like how the front looks.

And is the door popper mechanical or electrical?

Otherwise, looks solid. Can be a pretty good commuter if you have your own garage and charger set up.

[asian_XL]

like it or not, I definitely don't want to see this again

https://shawglobalnews.files.wordpress.com/2017/04/gas.jpg?quality=70&strip=all&w=720&h=480&crop=1

[GS8]

Tesla posts record quarterly loss of $619M on Model 3 delays | Financial Post (http://business.financialpost.com/pmn/business-pmn/tesla-swings-to-671m-loss-on-model-3-delays)

[Gerbs]

Bought in at $320 hit $305 in after market hours

[gilly]

Watched bits of the video.


And is the door popper mechanical or electrical?



Both. There is a fail safe mechanical mechanism near the drivers door handle if the electrical button fails. Not sure if there is one on every door though.

[TOS'd]

Both. There is a fail safe mechanical mechanism near the drivers door handle if the electrical button fails. Not sure if there is one on every door though.

Just the front two, none for the back two.

[freakshow]

Both. There is a fail safe mechanical mechanism near the drivers door handle if the electrical button fails. Not sure if there is one on every door though.

Just the front two, none for the back two.

It looks like the 3's handles are completely mechanical in the video

[Nlkko]

That Tesla Roadster S is fineee:

https://tctechcrunch2011.files.wordpress.com/2017/11/tesla-semi_46.jpg?w=738

https://techcrunch.com/2017/11/16/tesla-unveils-the-new-roadster/