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Questions & info about the Motor Vehicle Act. Mature discussion only.

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Old 04-02-2010, 10:45 AM   #76
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The repeated knees to the back of the second suspect were definitely excessive. If you watch the video, the suspects left hand was underneath of him with the 2 cops holding him down. They were trying to cuff him and he was kneeing him in the spine because he COULDN'T give them his other hand. I know in that situation with 2 190 pound cops holding me down, I couldn't have gotten my hand out from under myself either.

The cop obviously likes kicking people when they are down. he kicks the first and second suspect in the same manner, as 2 or more other officers were holding the suspects and they were more or less under control. You gotta remember there's not a lot you can do when cops are holding you down and have your hands behind your back. They might perceive your inability to stand up for them as resisting arrest.

Personally, I have shoulder damage from a motorcycle accident, and my arm will not bend behind my back without tearing scar tissue in my shoulder muscles. I think police have to pay more attention to the suspects body position, (Can he cooperate in his current position?) if the officer had payed attention to the second suspects arm being trapped underneath him, the blows to the suspects spine would not have happened, unless he did know, and kneed him anyway thinking nobody would notice.

I don't have much faith in police anymore, i used to when i was younger, i wanted to be a cop and help people. But learning from the last 20 years of my life, they always seem to be there to give me a bicycle helmet ticket when i'm 14, or do nothing when something bad happens to me. I've never had the police come through for me when something is stolen (ie the guy i caught on camera walking out of my apartment front door with my $1400 bicycle, i even knew his name.) or care if someone assaulted me. numerous occasions where justice was not served yet there was sufficient evidence. i live my life as a descent person but for what? the way i see it, you get nailed anyway.
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Old 04-02-2010, 10:52 AM   #77
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Your analogy would make perfect sense if the guy was involved in an off-camera fistfight with officer yellowjacket. We know this wasn't the case since he wasn't charged with assault, resisting arrest, etc...

The kid in the plaid shirt was asking the officer to help his friend - his body language and hand movments indicate that this is likely true.

The second soccerball - complied immediately with orders to get down on the ground. If he was a previously combative subject this likely wouldn't have happened. His body language, facial expression - both to me show shock that the officer is not helping but ordering him to be handcuffed.

My opinion remains - the officer yellowjacked used too much force too soon given the circumstances.
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Old 04-02-2010, 11:11 AM   #78
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Well he was involved in an off-camera assault on another civilian who was kicked, repeatedly, in the head...

If either of them would have been complying immediately, then a single officer should have no problem ordering them down, and cuffing them within a few seconds. This was not the case and should be pretty obvious. If you don't believe you should be handcuffed you still shouldn't resist it, does any harm really come to you if you comply and get handcuffed while the police sort some things out?

Alright so when do you think would have been a good time for the officer in the yellow jacket to step in and use a bit of force to help his fellow officers? After they've been struggling to arrest someone for a few minutes?
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Old 04-02-2010, 12:59 PM   #79
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Well he was involved in an off-camera assault on another civilian who was kicked, repeatedly, in the head...

If either of them would have been complying immediately, then a single officer should have no problem ordering them down, and cuffing them within a few seconds. This was not the case and should be pretty obvious. If you don't believe you should be handcuffed you still shouldn't resist it, does any harm really come to you if you comply and get handcuffed while the police sort some things out?

Alright so when do you think would have been a good time for the officer in the yellow jacket to step in and use a bit of force to help his fellow officers? After they've been struggling to arrest someone for a few minutes?
I just realized that they probably got kicked with steel toe boots (or equivalent!).

Anyway, to be fair, I think the officer in the yellow jacket should have given him more than 1.5 seconds after he said "put your hands behind your back", until he kicked him.
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Old 04-02-2010, 01:07 PM   #80
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Perhaps when the kid immediately complied with the order to "get down on the ground" the officer should have issued another order to get face down and put his hands behind his back. But no, the other officer charged in and things escalated quickly from there.
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Old 04-02-2010, 02:29 PM   #81
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Is officer yellowjacket still on administrative leave? Is the Vancouver PD investigation into this use of force still ongoing?
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Old 04-04-2010, 11:03 PM   #82
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Old 04-07-2010, 11:03 PM   #83
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Although the VicPD/person numbers seem way higher than VanPD/person... Vic/Saanich police have always been nice to me...
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Old 04-08-2010, 11:10 AM   #84
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Now that I know a bit more about the "victim" I feel no sympathy for him whatsoever. Not to say that cops should run around booting every dirtbag. (I know some people who know him personally/played lacrosse with him)
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Old 04-08-2010, 11:16 AM   #85
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Now that I know a bit more about the "victim" I feel no sympathy for him whatsoever. Not to say that cops should run around booting every dirtbag. (I know some people who know him personally/played lacrosse with him)
Sorry, what does that mean? I can't read between the lines.
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Old 04-08-2010, 08:09 PM   #86
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I don't need context to see that's a disgusting and disgraceful act.
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Old 04-09-2010, 09:39 AM   #87
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The actual victim is said to be the guy lying on the sidewalk in the background of the video, the idiots being cuffed were the ones attacking him.
Incorrect.

The individual on the grass being kicked by the officer in the video is supposedly the victim of the initial assault.

Reference:

http://www.theprovince.com/kicked+se...689/story.html
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Old 04-09-2010, 11:54 AM   #88
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Sorry, what does that mean? I can't read between the lines.
Just thats he's a cokehead brawler who thrives on causing trouble, and just because he doesnt have a record doesnt mean the police arent familiar with him
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Old 04-09-2010, 12:42 PM   #89
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Incorrect.

The individual on the grass being kicked by the officer in the video is supposedly the victim of the initial assault.

Reference:

http://www.theprovince.com/kicked+se...689/story.html
Gotcha, thanks. I don't see why he would resist the officers then.
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Old 04-09-2010, 12:59 PM   #90
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Gotcha, thanks. I don't see why he would resist the officers then.
Whether he was actually resisting the officers or not is what the debate is all about, is it not?
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:18 PM   #91
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True, to me it looks like he is resisting more than I would be in that kind of situation. But that's just me, we'll see how the whole deal turns out.
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:31 PM   #92
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Incorrect.

The individual on the grass being kicked by the officer in the video is supposedly the victim of the initial assault.

Reference:

http://www.theprovince.com/kicked+se...689/story.html
Sorry, you're incorrect. The victim of the initial assault was indeed the one unconscious on the sidewalk in the background. He was taken to the hospital where he was checked out and released. He refused to co-operate with police which is why there are to be no charges against the people who were assaulting him.

http://www.theprovince.com/news/Vict...860/story.html
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Old 04-09-2010, 01:55 PM   #93
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Sorry, you're incorrect. The victim of the initial assault was indeed the one unconscious on the sidewalk in the background. He was taken to the hospital where he was checked out and released. He refused to co-operate with police which is why there are to be no charges against the people who were assaulting him.

http://www.theprovince.com/news/Vict...860/story.html
Ok I stand corrected he was not the victim of the original assault, but according to the article I posted he wasn't one of the participants (assailants?) in that original assault either.
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Old 10-21-2010, 10:16 PM   #94
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So its been 7 months, have they finished their "investigation" yet?
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Old 10-23-2010, 07:57 AM   #95
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Hey i just read the first page again and Zulutango mentions a couple times that, Big guy, worst pain ever but paramedics didnt do anything

Doesnt the police learn dominating positions, and to bring pain but minimal injury? like twisting the arm? Twisting arm hurts like a bitch and in like competitive fighting, even the biggest guys have to tap out, but i gather once its let go, itll be fine and not really much paramedics will do about it.?? just a thought.
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Old 10-23-2010, 10:01 AM   #96
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show what kind of people are supposed to "protect us".
these are not cops they ar PIGS.
Cops treat evryone equalit listen to the story and handle situations profesionaly.
Pigs asume your guilty pull the trigger without thinking and are just in a rage when they do their job. These guys are pigs. the 2nd guy was on the ground and the cop ran up like he had a knife or somthing and got kicked like a animal.
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Old 10-23-2010, 10:57 AM   #97
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show what kind of people are supposed to "protect us".
these are not cops they ar PIGS.
Cops treat evryone equalit listen to the story and handle situations profesionaly.
Pigs asume your guilty pull the trigger without thinking and are just in a rage when they do their job. These guys are pigs. the 2nd guy was on the ground and the cop ran up like he had a knife or somthing and got kicked like a animal.
You are an idiot. Those guys deserved every boot they got, you resist arrest you get your ass handed to you by the cops. Simple as that.

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Old 10-23-2010, 03:21 PM   #98
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You are an idiot. Those guys deserved every boot they got, you resist arrest you get your ass handed to you by the cops. Simple as that.
I didn't see resistance, I saw compliance.
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Old 10-23-2010, 05:35 PM   #99
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I didn't see resistance, I saw compliance.
Well maybe we watched different video's? Either way, if you do something that warrants an arrest from the cops, be it drunken stupidity or otherwise, you've crossed the line from being a law-abating citizen to an idiot. There is nothing pretty in getting arrested, and if the police think you are giving them a hard time they have every right to step on your neck. Don't piss off the cops and you won't get a beat down.

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Old 10-25-2010, 12:45 AM   #100
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You are an idiot. Those guys deserved every boot they got, you resist arrest you get your ass handed to you by the cops. Simple as that.
next time you sit on the ground when a cop tells you to and u still get kneed in the back i hope i can stand there to laugh at you.
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