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HealthCare & Wellness Breaking the Chains of Addiction. The Last Door Recovery Society
Mature discussion surrounding important health issues and concerns. Alternative therapies, healthcare questions, discussion of community resources, peer support help, group therapy, etc.

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Old 10-16-2011, 05:00 PM   #76
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I was talking about the fact that he wanted to take deca without pinning any test.

I would like to point out that I have nothing against roids. I am against people doing stupid shit that ends up fucking up their body since that is part of the reason that this stuff is illegal. If you are gonna be too much of a pussy to poke yourself with a needle then stick to legal supplements.

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Old 10-16-2011, 06:21 PM   #77
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did your pecs get smaller?
lol no, just the lighting and way im standing i guess hahaha, i saw that too when i first took the photo hahaha.
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Old 10-16-2011, 08:59 PM   #78
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I don't see where the 20 lbs went. Glutes maybe
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Old 10-16-2011, 09:16 PM   #79
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I don't see where the 20 lbs went. Glutes maybe
nah, my ass aint fat, wanna see that as well?
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Old 10-16-2011, 11:32 PM   #80
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you look a bit bigger, hope everything is going well
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It's not the steroids that makes the champion but it's hard training .. dedication, the diet and sacrifice and genetics that person has.. what makes the champion.
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Old 10-17-2011, 09:21 PM   #81
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Shoulders look a lot rounder for sure.

Let's be clear on one thing. Steroids are NOT illegal because they have the potential to be harmful to the body. Let's face it, if that were the case tobacco and alcohol would also be illegal.

Steroids are illegal BECAUSE THEY WORK. Period. IF steroids were legal, it would change the face of humanity. Starting with sports. It has been proven time and time again that natural athletes can NOT compare to people who are on steroids. From baseball to football, track and field and all sports in between. People who do steroids WIN. It is because of that fact that making steroids legal would then open the floodgates and the natural athlete would be become extinct because there is no way a natural athlete can compare and therefore would be forced into taking steroids just to stay competitive. You can argue that long term use is detrimental to the body. Then I will point out many MANY bodybuilders that are doing just fine. Arnie, Lou, Coleman just to name a few. Why don't you hear about bodybuilders having heart attacks and dieing at young ages on a regular basis? Because steroids are NOT bad for you that's why. Sure there are side effects but there are side effects with cold meds and a host of other things we take on a regular basis.
Further to that argument. It's easy to say "oh you want to gain just eat more/ get a proper diet blah blah blah" to that I say FUCK THAT. Let's do a common working mans daily life shall we? Get up at 6 or 7 am, scarf some breakfast. Head to work. Lets say your in the labor force. You spend the day digging/shoveling/lifting heavy shit/ etc etc. You get 3 breaks. 2 15's and 1 half hour. You don't have the luxury of saying... yea sorry I need to stop and eat for a minute to get a meal in. JOBS DON'T WORK THAT WAY. So you put your 8 hours in (in many labor jobs your getting off easy at 8 hours and often work up 10 hours. So you get home at 5ish after working your ass off all day. Now you gotta drive some dinner into you before you hit the gym. Get to the gym around 7 if your lucky and workout until 8-9. Go home rub one out and hit the sack and get ready to do it all again. When am I supposed to be getting all these calories in? When am I supposed to be preparing all these meals I'm supposed to eat to "get big" when I can barely find time to take a shit? If you don't slave away all day and burn all your calories and if you have time in the night AND THE MOTIVATION to precook all your meals for the next day. Congrats! Me however.... I don't give a shit. I can get the same results as the average person working out for a year in 3 months with steroids. I call that being efficient. Once you get over the "STEROIDS ARE BAD FOR YOU" bullshit you can just enjoy LIFE on a daily basis and not fucking stress about getting your meals in.

Sorry for the long rant just wanted to kinda give the flipside to the coin here.

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Old 10-17-2011, 10:12 PM   #82
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Old 10-17-2011, 10:46 PM   #83
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Berz you can name 3 bodybuilders that are doing just fine, I can name 100+ wrestlers and bodybuilders who died in their 40s-50s because of steroid abuse.

Steroid is a DRUG. Like some DRUGS you can 'get away with it just fine' with the absolute correct use. But it still does changes to your body - some irreversible. Whether it's tobacco, alcohol, marijuana, LSD, cocaine, heroin, or steroids, they are all DRUGS that can FUCK YOU UP. Now you or Arnold might have been able to be 'just fine' doing steroids, and someone might be able to get along 'just fine' on opiates... but for a lot of people, probably the majority, that won't be the case.
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Old 10-17-2011, 10:52 PM   #84
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There's a difference between abuse and use... you abuse anything you can fuck yourself up, yea if your on test/tren/slin/dbol/decca/hgh for year(s) straight obviously there's going to be repercussions. One proper 12 week cycle once or twice a year with proper PCT youll be good as new
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Old 10-17-2011, 11:23 PM   #85
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YEah but that doesn't mean it's not a drug. If you used cocaine for a few weeks, you'd be fine too. But cocaine isn't illegal because it "makes people better" just like steroids isn't illegal for that same reason.
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Old 10-17-2011, 11:43 PM   #86
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berz, what you said about people saying "eat more then", well said!

I do work hard manual labor form 7-330, i only get 2 15's and a 30, and i DONT have the option of being able to sit my ass at a computer desk all day working and having the luxury of a lunch room with a fridge or a microwave where i can reheat some food...so i either eat cold left overs wich tastes like shit most of the time, or i eat sandwiches. at the end of the day, i come home eat dinner, go to the gym, make another quick small meal and then bed. sure you see me on facebook dickin around, but half the time its from my cellphone or im at home and waiting for food to cook or before i go to bed.

ive tried gaining weight the legit way...doesnt work so well for my lifestyle, so fuck it.
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Old 10-17-2011, 11:47 PM   #87
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berz, what you said about people saying "eat more then", well said!

I do work hard manual labor form 7-330, i only get 2 15's and a 30, and i DONT have the option of being able to sit my ass at a computer desk all day working and having the luxury of a lunch room with a fridge or a microwave where i can reheat some food...so i either eat cold left overs wich tastes like shit most of the time, or i eat sandwiches. at the end of the day, i come home eat dinner, go to the gym, make another quick small meal and then bed. sure you see me on facebook dickin around, but half the time its from my cellphone or im at home and waiting for food to cook or before i go to bed.

ive tried gaining weight the legit way...doesnt work so well for my lifestyle, so fuck it.
That's no excuse. You don't have to eat throughout the day, you can eat most of your calories in 2 or 3 meals. In fact, this might even be the best way to eat.
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:02 AM   #88
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im getting results without steroids so fuck steroids lol
at the end of the day do whatever the fuck u wanan do
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Old 10-18-2011, 05:24 AM   #89
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berz, what you said about people saying "eat more then", well said!

I do work hard manual labor form 7-330, i only get 2 15's and a 30, and i DONT have the option of being able to sit my ass at a computer desk all day working and having the luxury of a lunch room with a fridge or a microwave where i can reheat some food...so i either eat cold left overs wich tastes like shit most of the time, or i eat sandwiches. at the end of the day, i come home eat dinner, go to the gym, make another quick small meal and then bed. sure you see me on facebook dickin around, but half the time its from my cellphone or im at home and waiting for food to cook or before i go to bed.

ive tried gaining weight the legit way...doesnt work so well for my lifestyle, so fuck it.
Excuses excuses excuses
Ive been working 84 hour weeks for months now doing hardcore manual labour and managed to put on 8 lbs in 3 months.
Also not to be an asshole but you sure are carrying a lot of fat for someone who does manual labour..
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Old 10-18-2011, 06:06 AM   #90
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Excuses excuses excuses
Ive been working 84 hour weeks for months now doing hardcore manual labour and managed to put on 8 lbs in 3 months.
Also not to be an asshole but you sure are carrying a lot of fat for someone who does manual labour..
what? so just because i do manual labour means i have to be ripped outta my mind??? if your trying to tell me that manual labour workers are all shredded....you my friend are fucking delusional....sure some of the guys are...MAYBE 2-3 of them where as the other 25+ are not.

alright, i made this thread to get some info, and now i met the right people who can keep pushing me in the right direction, so fuck this thread.
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Old 10-18-2011, 06:35 AM   #91
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YEah but that doesn't mean it's not a drug. If you used cocaine for a few weeks, you'd be fine too. But cocaine isn't illegal because it "makes people better" just like steroids isn't illegal for that same reason.
Your trying to compare Steroids to Cocaine? Gimme a break. Steroids when taken properly are GOOD FOR YOU. Why do you think doctors PRESCRIBE IT to help people in therapy. I don't think your ever going to hear "Here's a flap with a half in it, take 3 lines and call me at 5 am to talk." There is no way to make cocaine anything but harmful to the body. Sure it may not kill you but it's in no way beneficial. Steroids on the other hand ARE. You should read Jose Canseco's book.

I also can name many many wrestlers that died early. Lets also look at their recreational drug use before we blame it on steroids. They are also pushing their bodies way beyond the average person doing a couple cycles a year. Again it's the difference between USE/ABUSE. The media blows up any time someone who has taken steroids dies because they want to shed a negative light on them to try and prevent usage. Anyone who has actually done them will tell you a different story.

For those of you saying "Yea I'm gaining steadily I don't need that shit." Congrats. You have a good body type. But there will come a day when you stop growing. Hal0 has hit that mark. He's been at 240lb for a long time now. He may have reached the limit of his body. He can eat and bulk and then diet and I bet he'll have a hell of a time getting past 250 when the smoke clears. So when YOU all get to that point you either have to be happy with what you have or do something about it.

As for Stewie carrying around a lot of "fat" I would say he looks like every other person who hits the gym and doesn't give a fuck about "cutting" I personally don't like the super lean ripped look and I really couldn't be fucked to diet to get there. If you do that's fine but don't insult someone because of their bodytype.

Berz out.
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Old 10-18-2011, 07:17 AM   #92
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OK not cocaine, how about opiates then. Whatever, same argument.
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:26 AM   #93
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This thread is fun now
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:31 AM   #94
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I have nothing for or against steroids, or for or against people who take steroids. Just have the balls to call it what it is...
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:02 PM   #95
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does steroids really shrink your balls? (serious question)

since your basically injecting testosterone, you'll have excess of it, your body notices this and pretty much stops making it, and since testosterone is produced in the testes...

correct if im wrong
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Old 10-18-2011, 01:28 PM   #96
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does steroids really shrink your balls? (serious question)

since your basically injecting testosterone, you'll have excess of it, your body notices this and pretty much stops making it, and since testosterone is produced in the testes...

correct if im wrong
With most steroids guys say they notice a small change. Honestly, I don't think it'll be that noticeable. And like any system in the body, it's not like it can't be restarted. Once you're off the fake stuff your testes get back in action. It can take awhile though as different steroids have varying half lives within the blood, and can take anywhere from 24 hours, to much longer to completely get "used up". A lot of guys also run Clomid to avoid these effects.

I'll try to put some good science in this thread. At the most basic level of understanding, testosterone = bigger muscles. Testosterone = made in testes. What causes testosterone to be made? The pituitary gland. How does it do this? It does this by releasing a hormone called Luteinizing Hormone (LH) that stimulates specific cells (Leydig cells) to make testosterone. Testosterone is converted to estrogen, and estrogen is what tells the pituitary to stop the testes from producing testosterone by not producing LH anymore.

Now, when you take testosterone, its pretty obvious that your pituitary is going to freak out, and literally stop your testicles from producing natural testosterone. Your body tries to maintain a balance of testosterone to estrogen, so when it gets extra testosterone, it tries to convert it to estrogen to maintain the balance. Guys run Clomid which works by blocking estrogen receptors at your pituitary. The pituitary doesn't detect much estrogen, and keeps secreting LH ---> testes stay active and produce more testosterone.

When you give a guy pure testosterone into his bloodstream, a lot of it is converted to estrogen, no more LH is produced, natural testosterone is cut off. So when a guy gets off the steroids, he's got a huge deficit in his natural test. This is why a lot of guys who are massive year round, run clomid (or some other similar substance) with anything they take. This is also why a lot of old school/misinformed guys say "as soon as your off the juice, you're gonna shrink". Not true.




I've had tons of arguments with girls and guys I know about steroids. I've had similar arguments about marijuana use. Understand your body, know what's being effected, and make the conscious decision. I've decided against steroids, but that doesn't mean everyone should. I have a few doctors in the family, and i've talked to all of them about steroid use. The older ones are against it (the ones who went through med school before aids even existed, who see steroids as just being "bad'). Then I talk to my cousins who are doctors, who have seen how Anavar (a steroid) can help aids patients, and their views aren't "pro steroid" use, but they see both sides of the argument.



Cliff notes:

Do steroids, it won't kill you.
Keep your testicles in the game while you're on the cycle
Be massive and healthy and happy.




Also, I'm using a very basic explanation. There are many steroids out there that work in different ways, and some are non aromatizing (do not get converted into estrogen, thereby not really effecting your body's natural test levels) but even those in high enough dosages can suppress your natural test production. Steroids are a clusterfuck of information. There's many different types that product many different results. There's also growth hormone which you can actually get a prescription for in the USA and up until recently you couldn't even tell through a blood test if someone was on GH or not.
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Old 10-18-2011, 02:43 PM   #97
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I can't wait for stewies depression to start when he finishes anavar.

If you fuck up your post cycle, you will go insane. Believe me.
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Old 10-18-2011, 03:24 PM   #98
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He's not on Anavar.

I've never had a problem with post cycle depression. I've never had a problem with Gyno and I've never had a problem with balls shrinking. I have many many friends that have done cycles and the only side effects I've seen is some bacne and severe muscle gain. I've also never done any PCT and never had a problem with my testosterone getting back in action. The last cycle I did was monitored by my doctor for my test levels and everything was perfect.

Education is the key.

Skinny. Opiates are legal. They are called Painkillers. 90% of today's painkillers derive from opiates. Opiates don't "enhance" you as a athlete therefore they are legal (although non legal for Olympic athletes and several other sports). Again your not going to find someone taking Codein to enhance their performance like steroids do. The only reason they are illegal is because the governing bodies of sports acknowledged a long time ago that sports are unfair if you allow people to use steroids. Non users simply can not compete. It's not a matter of "good for you bad for you" at all.

Berz out.
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Old 10-18-2011, 03:58 PM   #99
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he's not doing post cycle, he never asked and isnt even stacking. He's fucking up.

I'm sorry but ignoring PCT is really really fucking dumb.
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Old 10-18-2011, 04:13 PM   #100
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The cycle he's doing doesn't need to be stacked. It's the perfect beginner cycle. As long as you ramp up and then taper off PCT isn't really needed. Besides that PCT is relatively new to the juice game. 10 years ago (my last cycle) PCT wasn't even really talked about. You just adjusted your dosage during your cycle to minimize the effects when you came off the juice.

Berz out.
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