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Old 08-10-2012, 01:39 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fliptuner View Post
There's a big difference between a national organization allowing foriegners to play vs. a local kid's soccer league not allowing people of a certain race to participate.
The reasoning behind it is the same though.

Whether it's reality or not, the East Indians are basically classifying themselves inferior as soccer players overall versus the general population, so in order to keep things competitive, they would like their teams to be primarily East Indian.

The premise is the same as if an able-bodied person wanted to play in Paralympics soccer. This is just an extreme example, where instead of race, it's disability, but the reasoning is the same - to try to keep the playing field more even by not allowing overqualified players.

Another more local example is the Asian Tournament for volleyball, held every year at Bonsor.

Each team is allowed one import player. Generally, Asians are shorter than the general population, which leads to a disadvantage in volleyball. By creating a competition only for Asians, it creates a more level (ie shorter) playing field.
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Old 08-10-2012, 01:42 PM   #27
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There's a little too much go back to Where ever your from going on in here. I feel bad for the kids, who i bet you have nothing to do with the decision to kick out there white friends. I am glad this is getting public attention hopefully the Indo-Canadian Soccer Association realizes their mistake and allows this team to play. The only way i can see this team not being allowed to play is if they are significantly better than the other teams, in which case perhaps this isn't a race issue and more of a skill level issue.
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Old 08-10-2012, 01:53 PM   #28
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this dude isolates an indo-canadian tournament and all these "go back to india' things come up. The segregation and not allowing "imports" to play isn't cool but the issue is beyond indo-canadians. Like mentioned before, there are croatian only leagues, fijian only leagues and so on. Also keep in mind that for these leagues or tournaments to happen with proper refs, they have to be approved by some bc governing soccer thing. Why not ask them why they allow this to occur...

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Old 08-10-2012, 02:33 PM   #29
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I played in the Italian soccer league(ICSF) in east Van as a kid for about 5-6 years?

The vast majority of us were definitely not Italian and it was a good mix of Caucasian and non-Caucasian players, hell one of my coaches was Filipino and the other Chinese, this shit ain't cool.
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Old 08-10-2012, 02:57 PM   #30
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the way the lower mainland is going, white people are seemingly the imports indeed.
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Old 08-10-2012, 03:40 PM   #31
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On the topic of been multicultural...

Quote:
Man stands by email: "Lose the traditions, or stay in India"
METRO VANCOUVER/CKNW (AM980)
Marcella Bernardo | Email news tips to Marcella
8/10/2012

Saying they must respect what he calls the 'Canadian way of living,' a man who wrote an offensive email in the wake of a deadly shooting at a temple in the U-S is standing by his comments against members of the Sikh community.


Dave Foran initially sent the email to Sher-e-Punjab Radio.


This morning, he defended its content with CKNW's Philip Till.

"There's nothing wrong with it if everybody kind of blends in and looks the same, but these people don't do that, they bring that religious thing with them."

"But how does it impact you?"

"I have to look at it. Other people have to look at it. I'm not the only here and I don't believe I'm prejudiced. I know lots of people from India. they blend in. they wear blue jeans. I don't want to live in India."

In the email, Foran insists he doesn't condone violence, but he believes 'Sikhs are disrespectful' because they don't 'blend in' after moving to Canada.

He goes on to say, 'your long beards, turbans, clothes and waddling as you follow each other down the street is enough to make us sick. Lose the traditions or stay in India.'

Dale Badh's family owns Sher-e-Punjab Radio.
He says Foran's comments are offensive because --as someone who's lived in Canada since 1975-- he's still not considered 'Canadian.'

"How are we disrespectful? It was very, very disturbing to me when I read that email and it still bothers me because what we've gone through in Wisconsin, what we've gone through after 9-11"

Badh says he doesn't wear a turban or beard, yet people keep calling him Indo-Canadian or South Asian, instead of simply Canadian.


Badh was speaking with CKNW's Philip Till

Local News Story
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Old 08-10-2012, 03:40 PM   #32
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Here is where the issue lies.

the USSL (United Summer Soccer League) is the only spring/summer soccer league in the Surrey/Delta area. The USSL is operated by the Indo-Canadian Soccer Association. So if your kid wants to play in a spring/summer soccer league in Surrey he/she has to register with the USSL, there-by adhering to the Indo-Canadian Soccer Association rules.

The politics that go on in youth soccer is absolutely ridiculous. BC Soccer needs to do a complete re-evaluation of clubs and leagues in the lower mainland, find the problems and correct them.
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Old 08-10-2012, 03:41 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by van_city23 View Post
this dude isolates an indo-canadian tournament and all these "go back to india' things come up. The segregation and not allowing "imports" to play isn't cool but the issue is beyond indo-canadians. Like mentioned before, there are croatian only leagues, fijian only leagues and so on. Also keep in mind that for these leagues or tournaments to happen with proper refs, they have to be approved by some bc governing soccer thing. Why not ask them why they allow this to occur...
I love people who say "go back to India"...what if you were born in Canada?
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Old 08-10-2012, 03:44 PM   #34
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then go back to India!

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Old 08-10-2012, 03:50 PM   #35
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I would love to see the reaction to a 'White Canadian U13 club'. might as well just burn a cross in your front yard
It has nothing to do with the colour of the skin...White people can qualify as indo-canadian so long as they have ancestors from India....The same way if someone is brown but has their entire family tree from pakistan, not India, he would be considered an 'import'....

So yeah....has nothing to do with the colour of skin...
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Old 08-10-2012, 03:52 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by Jah Dean View Post
I love people who say "go back to India"...what if you were born in Canada?
I'd bet the vast majority of people supporting the prevention of "imports" from entering the soccer league were not born in Canada. First generation immigrants tend to segregate themselves, while the second generation is much more interested in associating with all groups.

Those are just my thoughts on this very specific case; generally speaking, I hate when someone says, "go back to XXXXX."
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Old 08-10-2012, 03:57 PM   #37
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Did a google search from what I understand an "Import" player means someone living outside of the community? in this case Surrey.. it has nothing to do with race? (if it does then these parents can take it to the human rights tribunal)
interestingly enough the ussa.ca website doesn't define what they consider an import/metro player it seems the reporter made up the "non indo-canadian players" part
this is Rule 32

Quote:
32. Two imports allowed for all divisions, except for boys U13 & 14 and girls U14 which will be allowed 4
imports. Metro or higher level players are not allowed to play on a silver team unless preapproval has been
given at the draws (this request must be made in person at the draws & name of players must be given).
Maximum of two metro (or higher level) players may play in silver. Please note a metro (or higher level)
player may only play on a silver team ONLY if your club does not have a gold team in that age group.
looks like years ago (2007) there was a major issue which hit the Human Rights Tribunal in which there were claims of Racism against Indo-Canadian players/staff for Surrey/Abby wherever it is

see this story Racism in soccer alleged



I don't really know the situation at all aside from these two stories but it seems like political soccer mom bs with a constant back and forth between the two sides

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Old 08-10-2012, 03:59 PM   #38
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Lol at imports...

Imported where, richmond? Maple ridge?


Yah i dont get it... Sour grapes...she got that right
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Old 08-10-2012, 04:00 PM   #39
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You ask ten random people on the street what the "Canadian way of living" is and you're going to get ten different answers. That's what makes this country so amazing to me.
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Old 08-10-2012, 04:13 PM   #40
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In 1998 Punjab Tigers Sports Club was started by a group of members of Indo Canadian community including Amritpal S. Atwal (Palla), Kanwaljit S. Somal, Ajinderpal S. Mangat (Neetu), and Harkeerat S. Kular. Based in Surrey, British Columbia Canada the club was established with a vision to provide young sportsperson with many opportunities to play soccer. The growth has taken Punjab Tigers Sports Club to over 500 members and hosting a major Indoor Soccer Tournament. In September 2009 the Club changed its name to BC TIGERS SPORTS CLUB to allow for diversity and broadband its efforts to intergrate into other communities.
But not enough, apparently.

I fully understand the desire behind having kids of a similar nationality all play together as it helps band the community together, especially in various cities where a large portion of the visible minority are new or relatively new to the country.

That said, I briefly went through the USSL website and rules section and couldn't find anything about limitations on "import" players. It does seem unfair that kids wanting to play soccer in Surrey/Delta are restricted to these rules, especially when nothing of that nature is stated on any of the websites I looked at.

Edit: Just saw Stylinred's link. That's just as vague as nothing at all.
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Old 08-10-2012, 04:33 PM   #41
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There is more to this story and Monday morning there should be a radio interview on I think it's CBC radio. I'm in full agreement with the team that was kicked out and not because I'm white but when you know the whole story and the reason this was brought to the medics attention you'll all (for the most part) side with the team too.
The poor kids were so upset. All they wanted to do is play as a team as they've done all season
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:25 PM   #42
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I think many people are misunderstanding the reasoning behind these private leagues. It's partially to control the level of competition and partially community. It has nothing to do with racism.

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The reasoning behind it is the same though.

Whether it's reality or not, the East Indians are basically classifying themselves inferior as soccer players overall versus the general population, so in order to keep things competitive, they would like their teams to be primarily East Indian.

The premise is the same as if an able-bodied person wanted to play in Paralympics soccer. This is just an extreme example, where instead of race, it's disability, but the reasoning is the same - to try to keep the playing field more even by not allowing overqualified players.

Another more local example is the Asian Tournament for volleyball, held every year at Bonsor.

Each team is allowed one import player. Generally, Asians are shorter than the general population, which leads to a disadvantage in volleyball. By creating a competition only for Asians, it creates a more level (ie shorter) playing field.
These are solid analogies. And to add to this, it's the same principle with co-ed sports (like hockey). The rules will state that "X" amount of females will have to be on at all times. But there will never be a rule saying "X" amount of males must be on at any given time. Simply put, when there's too many males playing (in this example, on one line), it becomes too dominant in co-ed play.

I joined a Chinese soccer league a few years ago, and they had similar rules. Only 3 (or 4) non-chinese players allowed per team. They wanted to keep it competitive, and not have 11 "Fobbish" Chinese guys get slaughtered by a team of 6' tall Europeans. There are many different leagues that will fit to different people. This seems like a case of just joining the wrong league and then blaming the league for it.


The problems I see with this is that:
1) The league failed for not catching on to this "illegal" roster earlier in the season, or even during registration.
2) The team for registering seven "imports" when the rule says maximum of four.

Like a few have already said, why didn't the mom just sign up in a regular soccer league that has no restriction...
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Old 08-10-2012, 05:39 PM   #43
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Old 08-10-2012, 06:14 PM   #44
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If non-indo canadians are a threat to their league in terms of skill levels, then they should tier it like any other sports league. I don't see the problem here other than outright racism.
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Old 08-10-2012, 07:49 PM   #45
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Honestly, I feel like the only wrong-doing here is the fact that the league allowed them to play originally, and that the game was stopped early due to complaints of foul play. Then again, who knows exactly why the game was stopped, as we've heard one side of the story.

However, I do not see anything wrong with an Indo-Canadian league. There are dozens and dozens of cultural-based sports organizations in our community. When I was growing up, I think very few of them existed. I was on public league teams that were predominately white. I didn't have a problem with it back then, and neither did any of the coaches or parents. Some kids did, but that's neither here nor there. Then again, that was a PUBLIC league...

I see no reason to join a league that is independent and private and then to complain about the way they conduct things. It's one of those situations where you are not forced to go and play there. I could be wrong, but I honestly don't think there is a shortage of players in ANY of the public soccer leagues. Surrey United, Peace Arch Soccer to name a few, are still thriving public soccer leagues.

Essentially this is the same as someone who is a non-Christian, trying to join a Christian soccer team/league. If you're not a Christian, you should already know that this league isn't for you...If they allow you to play however, that's great, good on that league for being tolerant and accepting of newcomers from different backgrounds...but if they decided to deny your application to play, then so be it, go join a public league.

I know the BC Christian Soccer Leauge requires its players to be members of a Christian church, and to attend mass regularly.

BC Christian Soccer League

Take a look at the constitution and pay close attention to Section 9, subsection A...In particular look for the terms "imports", "other Church" and "Witness Clause."

"One Church-based teams. Each team official and player shall be a regular attender at the church, which they represent; however, a player whose church does not have a team may play for any League team. The maximum number of “Other Church” import players per team in this category is three."

"“Other Church” Import Players. A player who attends another church, which does not have a team in the League, is considered an “Other Church” import. A player who attends no church at all is considered a “Witness Clause” import. "

" “Witness Clause” Import Players. Up to three players who do not attend any church may be on a team’s roster. Every season, a letter for each player must be sent to the President and must be approved by the Executive Committee (each situation will be based on its own merits and approvals are not automatic). The spirit behind this rule is not to stack teams, but to reach out to others who do not know Christ and introduce them to Jesus according to the League Statement and Principles."


It's the EXACT same thing and I for one, have NO problem with that because it is a private league and I have plenty of other options to play in many other competitive leagues.

Is this excluding members of other cultures? YES. Is this limiting players based on religion? YES! Is this wrong? I don't think so...It's a PRIVATE league who's title clearly indicates that it is a league designed for Christian members. It's PRIVATE and chances are the players and teams pay a nice premium to keep the structure of the league the way that it is.

The only wrong-doing I see in this situation was that they allowed the team to play in the tournament and then decided that they were not eligible afterwards. That is poor-organization and sportsmanship...But then again, it's the only side of the story we've heard. I'm sure the other side would beg to differ and provide alternative reasoning for why the game was stopped.
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Old 08-10-2012, 08:38 PM   #46
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Exactly. It's the fact that their team was given the green light at the beginning of the season, yet it wasn't until basically at the end of the playoffs that someone finally said, "Hey, wait... you can't do that!"

I don't have a problem with private leagues doing their own thing; when my work does their yearly baseball tournaments, we have limitations for our own "import" players. However, if a mistake was made by allowing this team to play in the first place, then they should have allowed it to continue and then make sure the necessary adjustments were made for the next season.

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There is more to this story and Monday morning there should be a radio interview on I think it's CBC radio. I'm in full agreement with the team that was kicked out and not because I'm white but when you know the whole story and the reason this was brought to the medics attention you'll all (for the most part) side with the team too.
The poor kids were so upset. All they wanted to do is play as a team as they've done all season
So what's the real story, then?
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Old 08-10-2012, 08:53 PM   #47
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they were winning...
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Old 08-10-2012, 08:58 PM   #48
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Yep, no one had a problem til they started winning.

Just like that RSA double amputee sprinter. There are a few people saying he might have an advantage with his prosthetics but he hasn't really won in big events. If he starts dominating, a hell of a lot more people will come out of the woodwork and protest.
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Old 08-10-2012, 10:23 PM   #49
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yah exactly, I don't think the issue is racism at all. It's more about that they started winning and ppl complained so the organizers had to uphold the rules. Now I assume the mother and the team got bitter because the rules state that they can only have a certain amount of 'imports' and they decided to make it a racial thing to get the media attention. The team should have looked up the rules themselves before playing with all the "imports" and understood that there MAY be consequences and now they have to live with them. Either way, this is something that has existed and doesn't need to be made into the big deal it is becoming.
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Old 08-10-2012, 10:53 PM   #50
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How many of you have played soccer? I'm not saying what is happening in that league is fair but with youth sports comes politics and stuff like this. If it isn't about having too many imports its coaches bringing ringers to tournaments that are over the age limit. Yes, even for teenaged tournaments. I've seen it and experienced it. A game is so one-sided that one team files a complaint at half time asking for the other team's players IDs, and not playing until they see it.

I remember I played in a Croatian tournament in Burnaby and each team was allowed three imports. I was one of them. I'm a visible minority. Is it right? That's debateable, but what the reporter fails to mention is that this is common across the board in soccer. Not just predominately indo-Canadian run leagues and tournaments.
I have, but not here.

When I played in Brazil, in a school league, there were refugees from Africa, Argentinians, even some Americans and Europeans. There was no bullshit. That may be predominant here, but sure as hell wasn't where I came from.

And, oh, by the way, Brazil is more multicultural than Canada, and we don't have these immigrant ghettos you guys have here.
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