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Vancouver Off-Topic / Current EventsThe off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.
I’m curious, do you guys all hate ICE? I can see why they need ICE in the US. They just have a terrible image now from Trump. I don’t believe the backlash was as bad as before Trumps term
Do you genuinely believe that what ICE is doing today in Minneapolis is immigration control? What border is Minneapolis near? What evidence is there that Minneapolis has an illegal immigration problem that justifies going door to door breaking into homes and arresting people without warrants (or proof)? What justifies stopping random vehicles on the streets and pulling their drivers out without evidence? What justifies putting grenades into civilian vehicles randomly?
America, like all nations, needs to control its borders to protect from illegal immigration where crime and exploitation are involved. More than half of the people that ICE has been detaining have no criminal record and many (most) are actually US citizens (some born in the US). Under Obama and Biden more people were deported from the US than under Trump yet we didn't see public executions and we didn't see illegal arrests and detainments. There was backlash then too but when you're not executing people in the streets then there will be less backlash. Your "both side-isms" is just bullshit.
What's happening now in Minneapolis (and previously Chicago and Los Angeles) is not immigration control. It's state sponsored terrorism against civilians.
One pic was from I’m assuming real nazis executing someone and one pic is untrained law enforcement trying to protect themselves assuming the worst. I’m not downplaying the situation, the nazi comparison doesn’t do it for me
ICE has been around since 2003, that guy that shot Good was a 10 year agent (from memory of something I read, could be slightly inaccurate, but he's no a n00b) so it's not JUST a training issue... it's a mandate and authoritative permissions issue in addition to really poor training.
We just never heard of them before because they were enforcing borders and immigration mostly properly as they should at the border and some operations here and there.
The problem is now they are being used as a masked terrorists and they're not enforcing borders anymore, they're targeting minorities and anyone who supports them. They're not ICE anymore as ICE is supposed to be, they're a gestappo with government funding.
One pic was from I’m assuming real nazis executing someone and one pic is untrained law enforcement trying to protect themselves assuming the worst. I’m not downplaying the situation, the nazi comparison doesn’t do it for me
Maybe you should read up about how the Gestapo was formed and what they did.
ICE is now a police force with self declared immunity against criminal acts (the DOJ refuses to investigate any crimes by them) that reports directly to the executive (Trump) and is being deployed selectively to areas where Trump has political opposition. It has the power to detain and imprison people without evidence (detainees are dying every 3 days in their custody). It is able to withhold legal counsel from any detainees and has been ignoring court orders to release detainees. It can now carry out public executions without penalty.
It currently is allowed to bypass the 1st amendment, the 2nd amendment, and the 4th amendment - again, they are being allowed to ignore not only the laws of the country but the rules that law enforcement are required to follow.
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The Gestapo fulfilled their mission in a radical way. In Nazi Germany, they used common police investigation methods. However, they did so without legal limits. They pursued denunciations from the public. They carried out arbitrary searches. And they conducted brutal interrogations. In the end, Gestapo agents held the fate of the people they arrested in their hands.
During the course of an investigation, Gestapo officers interviewed witnesses, searched homes and apartments, and conducted surveillance. In Nazi Germany, there were no limits to these activities. The Gestapo did not need a warrant to read a suspect’s mail, enter a home, or listen to telephone conversations.
Gestapo agents had the power to determine people’s fates. Individual agents could choose to be lenient. They could let people go, dismiss cases, or issue warnings and fines.
But Gestapo agents could also choose to be ruthless. They could detain someone in prison indefinitely or condemn someone to a concentration camp. The only monitoring of these decisions came from within the Gestapo itself.
In the first two years of the Nazi regime, the Gestapo did not focus on policing Germany’s Jewish population. At that time, the Gestapo’s priority was policing political opponents. The Gestapo did arrest some Jews in 1933 and 1934.
The last bit is where we are today, and tomorrow it'll be the rest of Americans who oppose Trump.
Do you genuinely believe that what ICE is doing today in Minneapolis is immigration control? What border is Minneapolis near? What evidence is there that Minneapolis has an illegal immigration problem that justifies going door to door breaking into homes and arresting people without warrants (or proof)? What justifies stopping random vehicles on the streets and pulling their drivers out without evidence? What justifies putting grenades into civilian vehicles randomly?
America, like all nations, needs to control its borders to protect from illegal immigration where crime and exploitation are involved. More than half of the people that ICE has been detaining have no criminal record and many (most) are actually US citizens (some born in the US). Under Obama and Biden more people were deported from the US than under Trump yet we didn't see public executions and we didn't see illegal arrests and detainments. There was backlash then too but when you're not executing people in the streets then there will be less backlash. Your "both side-isms" is just bullshit.
What's happening now in Minneapolis (and previously Chicago and Los Angeles) is not immigration control. It's state sponsored terrorism against civilians.
I agree with you. However, before Renee Good was murdered, there were already protests against ICE and impeding of their operations. The back lash was already huge before that. The murder just snowballed everything and now it probably won’t stop. I believe in peaceful protests, I don’t believe in the obstruction of ICE operations. Media has amplified everything and more people will continue to lose their lives. It’s either ICE leaves the state or protestors stand down, I don’t see either happening anytime soon
ICE is now a police force with self declared immunity against criminal acts (the DOJ refuses to investigate any crimes by them) that reports directly to the executive (Trump) and is being deployed selectively to areas where Trump has political opposition. It has the power to detain and imprison people without evidence (detainees are dying every 3 days in their custody). It is able to withhold legal counsel from any detainees and has been ignoring court orders to release detainees. It can now carry out public executions without penalty.
It currently is allowed to bypass the 1st amendment, the 2nd amendment, and the 4th amendment - again, they are being allowed to ignore not only the laws of the country but the rules that law enforcement are required to follow.
The last bit is where we are today, and tomorrow it'll be the rest of Americans who oppose Trump.
I can see why people are fear mongering, but I believe all of it is exaggerated. All this fear is just leading to more deaths. We know Trump is a terrible person but, I don’t believe trump will round up regular citizens and put them in gas chambers, that’s a bit too far fetched for me to believe
I agree with you. However, before Renee Good was murdered, there were already protests against ICE and impeding of their operations. The back lash was already huge before that. The murder just snowballed everything and now it probably won’t stop. I believe in peaceful protests, I don’t believe in the obstruction of ICE operations. Media has amplified everything and more people will continue to lose their lives. It’s either ICE leaves the state or protestors stand down, I don’t see either happening anytime soon
The backlash existed because Minneapolis isn't the first city Trump has tried to terrorise. It started with LA and Chicago which, surprise, surprise, are cities that are Liberal and lead by major critics of Trump (Newsom and Pritzker).
ICE tried to do the same thing they're doing in Minneapolis in those cities and there were protests there too but ICE had to back down as the police forces there were far larger than ICE (at the time). ICE outnumbers the Minneapolis policy 5:1 so they have free run of the city now.
This has been a ramp-up of activity through the first year of Trump and Trump has now found a city small enough to terrorise.
re: Obstructing ICE operations - do you believe the ICE operations today are legitimate and legal? 73% of the people they have detained have no criminal record. Many are US citizens. None are being read their rights. They are using methods of detainment that would be illegal if used by police or military.
If you believe these actions are legitimate and legal please explain why.
If you believe they are illiegal and illegitimate then why shouldn't citizens obstruct it?
The backlash existed because Minneapolis isn't the first city Trump has tried to terrorise. It started with LA and Chicago which, surprise, surprise, are cities that are Liberal and lead by major critics of Trump (Newsom and Pritzker).
ICE tried to do the same thing they're doing in Minneapolis in those cities and there were protests there too but ICE had to back down as the police forces there were far larger than ICE (at the time). ICE outnumbers the Minneapolis policy 5:1 so they have free run of the city now.
This has been a ramp-up of activity through the first year of Trump and Trump has now found a city small enough to terrorise.
re: Obstructing ICE operations - do you believe the ICE operations today are legitimate and legal? 73% of the people they have detained have no criminal record. Many are US citizens. None are being read their rights. They are using methods of detainment that would be illegal if used by police or military.
If you believe these actions are legitimate and legal please explain why.
If you believe they are illiegal and illegitimate then why shouldn't citizens obstruct it?
I don’t believe that their methods of detainment are legitimate. But the worst case as a citizen is that you’ll be detained and eventually let go. They’re making it sound like you’ll never see the light of day again and be executed while being detained. Again, fear mongering.
That’s still 27% of non-citizens being arrested, some with history of violence, pedos, sex and drug traffickers? What if the citizens are obstructing those arrests? At what point do citizens know who they should protect and not? ICE is definitely in the wrong for making wrong arrests.
I can see why people are fear mongering, but I believe all of it is exaggerated. All this fear is just leading to more deaths. We know Trump is a terrible person but, I don’t believe trump will round up regular citizens and put them in gas chambers, that’s a bit too far fetched for me to believe
He's ALREADY rounding up regular CITIZENS! Back in October they were already up to 170 citizens that had been detained! People held without right to counsel.
EL PASO, Texas - The death of a Cuban national at a federal immigration detention camp in El Paso has been ruled a homicide, according to autopsy findings released Wednesday by the El Paso Medical Examiner’s office.
They're already killing people in detention - they don't need gas chambers. If their local facilities aren't enough they'll send them to El Salvador.
Even before the U.S. was involved, many human rights organizations criticized El Salvador's prisons and especially CECOT. Groups have reported human rights violations including torture, mass trials and hundreds of inmate deaths.
He's ALREADY rounding up regular CITIZENS! Back in October they were already up to 170 citizens that had been detained! People held without right to counsel.
“ As for the U.S. deportations, lawyers for and relatives of the migrants sent to El Salvador say they are not gang members and that they had no opportunity to contest the U.S. government's assertion that they were”.
Yea that part is messed up, I can agree with that. But per the article “even before US was involved” that place was already messed up. Are you implying that all non republicans will be sent there and be forced to die? That’s pretty extreme
I have my doubts about Trump actually mass executing people as well.......... but the problem is a slippery slope whatever you see in front of you right now is the pointy tip of the spear if left uncontrolled.. and if he (Trump) suddenly... leaves this world, and someone like, say, Stephen Miller for all intents and purposes takes charge... that is definitely a possibility with precedent already being set.
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Originally Posted by 68style
We just never heard of them before because they were enforcing borders and immigration mostly properly as they should at the border and some operations here and there.
They weren't great before either, they're just a lot worse now that they're kidnapping 5 year olds to use as bait and murdering civilians in the street.
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Originally Posted by RevYouUp
That’s still 27% of non-citizens being arrested, some with history of violence, pedos, sex and drug traffickers? What if the citizens are obstructing those arrests? At what point do citizens know who they should protect and not? ICE is definitely in the wrong for making wrong arrests.
That means they're getting 73% of their job wrong? If any of us was that incompetent we'd be fired immediately. The regular cops should be the ones going after violent offenders, pedos, and traffickers and processing them correctly, not these clowns just fluking into getting some by grabbing people at random.
__________________ 1991 Toyota Celica GTFour RC // 2007 Toyota Rav4 V6 // 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee
1992 Toyota Celica GT-S ["sold"] \\ 2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee CRD [sold] \\ 2000 Jeep Cherokee [sold] \\ 1997 Honda Prelude [sold] \\ 1992 Jeep YJ [sold/crashed] \\ 1987 Mazda RX-7 [sold] \\ 1987 Toyota Celica GT-S [crushed]
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Originally Posted by maksimizer
half those dudes are hotter than ,my GF.
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Originally Posted by RevYouUp
reading this thread is like waiting for goku to charge up a spirit bomb in dragon ball z
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Originally Posted by Good_KarMa
OH thank god. I thought u had sex with my wife. :cry:
I don’t believe that their methods of detainment are legitimate. But the worst case as a citizen is that you’ll be detained and eventually let go. They’re making it sound like you’ll never see the light of day again and be executed while being detained. Again, fear mongering.
Thirty people in 2025, and six more so far in 2026, have died in an ICE detention system that has seen vastly reduced oversight and a several-month cutoff in payments to medical providers
Quote:
Originally Posted by RevYouUp
That’s still 27% of non-citizens being arrested, some with history of violence, pedos, sex and drug traffickers? What if the citizens are obstructing those arrests? At what point do citizens know who they should protect and not? ICE is definitely in the wrong for making wrong arrests.
5% of detainees have a record of violent crime so ICE currently has a 1 in 20 hit rate of actually capturing someone who's "bad". 6% of them have a traffic violation. BTW: Cute of you to throw in "pedos" into the list of crimes to try to make these detainees seem more dangerous but in the US being a pedophile gets your elected President.
Need I mention that immigrants, particularly illegal ones, have a lower crime rate than native born Americans? Kristi Noem says they are going after the "worst of the worst" yet their own data shows they are not - at best they are grossly incompetent (especially compared to Obama/Biden era enforcement) and she should be fired for her poor performance, at worst she is lying and deliberating targeting innocent people.
If trump is a pedo he deserves to go to jail. Ya’ll always bring that in to anything. It’s like you think conservatives support pedos are something. Sounds hypocritical I know
Yea, we can agree that ICE is incompetent. However, you can also argue that letting any dangerous non-citizen roam is not good as well. How many deaths have non-citizens caused? Where are the protests for those victims?
If trump is a pedo he deserves to go to jail. Ya’ll always bring that in to anything. It’s like you think conservatives support pedos are something. Sounds hypocritical I know
He is a 38 time convicted felon. Also conservatives do support pedos. Lots of his supporters have said they don't care he is a pedo.
I don’t know why anyone would bring a firearm to protest knowing ICE is trigger friendly
You're a fucking idiot man, how come you always have to fall on the other side of the argument, and never can call out what is glaringly right or wrong? This isn't some stupid team sport.
Minnesota is an open carry state, these same MAGA fucks are the ones that espouse the idea of 2nd amendment rights. He had legal carry, and never reached for his weapon once.
So what, we're now saying 2nd amendment doesn't apply when it suits the argument to murder someone in cold blood?
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by MG1
In Mike we Trust
Quote:
Originally Posted by westopher
LOOK AT ME IM MIKE AND I HAVE A BIG HOG AND I DRINK TEQULA AND WORK OUT AND LISTEN TO CHARLI XCX ON THE BEACH IN BERMUDA
Grow up fuckin Peter Pan and get a good nights rest.
I take back the fucking idiot comment by the way, Rev.
That shooting has me hyped up, but I should keep it respectful.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MG1
In Mike we Trust
Quote:
Originally Posted by westopher
LOOK AT ME IM MIKE AND I HAVE A BIG HOG AND I DRINK TEQULA AND WORK OUT AND LISTEN TO CHARLI XCX ON THE BEACH IN BERMUDA
Grow up fuckin Peter Pan and get a good nights rest.
If trump is a pedo he deserves to go to jail. YaÂ’ll always bring that in to anything. ItÂ’s like you think conservatives support pedos are something. Sounds hypocritical I know
Yea, we can agree that ICE is incompetent. However, you can also argue that letting any dangerous non-citizen roam is not good as well. How many deaths have non-citizens caused? Where are the protests for those victims?
The above would just reinforce any republicans justification for their vote. IÂ’m not saying itÂ’s right but I can see the argument from both sides
Why flood Minnesota with 1000's of Ice agents when they have a small amount of illegals compared to many other states, especially a bunch of Red ones, when statistics show states like Texas have 17x as many, Florida 10x as many yet the concentration of these goons is mainly in blue states. If it was as simple as they are trying to get dangerous immigrants out the dispersion and concentration of ICE force would reflect that based on where these people are but that's not the goal, it's all about beating down and attacking Blue States, with Trumps private goon squad. They want people to fight back, they want to put troops on the streets so they can steal future elections, I think Pam Bondi's letter to the Gov. of Minnesota made that pretty clear.
__________________
“The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It's a very mean and nasty place... and I don´t care how tough you are, it will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently, if you let it. You, me or nobody, is gonna hit as hard as life. But ain't about how hard you hit... It's about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward... how much you can take, and keep moving forward. That´s how winning is done. Now, if you know what you worth, go out and get what you worth.” - Rocky Balboa
If trump is a pedo he deserves to go to jail. Ya’ll always bring that in to anything. It’s like you think conservatives support pedos are something. Sounds hypocritical I know
Maybe he should release the files he's been sitting on rather than distract us from them by invading a country and having his Gestapo go around murdering people.
That said, at this point, if you don't believe the evidence already on whether he's a pedophile or not then nothing in the Epstein file will convince you. You'll say it wasn't pedophile-y enough in the same way that Megyn Kelly said that 16 is not a child anymore.
Feel free to watch this recording of a woman who has filed a sworn affidavit that Trump (and Epstein) raped her repeatedly when she was 13 years old
Trump is a pedophile in the same way that Michael Jackson is a pedophile and OJ Simpson is a murderer - the evidence is overwhelming and while none were convicted only a fool would deny that all 3 did it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RevYouUp
Yea, we can agree that ICE is incompetent. However, you can also argue that letting any dangerous non-citizen roam is not good as well. How many deaths have non-citizens caused? Where are the protests for those victims?
What about all the deaths that are caused by CITIZENS? Where are the protests for the hundreds of thousands of people that Trump has killed by ending the USAID programs? What about the tens of thousands of people who will die due to cuts in health care?
How about we have enforce the laws that we have equally and have the people who are tasked with enforcing those laws enforce them as they currently do? How about we do it competently by reading them their rights, assigning them counsel, and assuming innocence till guilt is proven?
Ah leave him alone. You guys basically chased away all the right wing cons already. Its turning into a gay ass echo chamber
Hondaracer started snorting fent and hanging out at downtown east side
Jason got banned and started snorting fent and hanging out at downtown east side
The tranny cop got scared off after ya’ll made fun of him
I never justified him being shot, I’m just saying ICE agents are now trigger friendly . Anything that they suspect will harm them will result in lethal force. Knowing that, why would anyone with a brain try to protest with a concealed weapon against them. They should assume that ICE agents are idiots and pussies in the first place.
I think people are all over you because your arguments are always double sided.
Your post literally says
Quote:
I never justified him being shot,
And literally the rest of your post are all the reasons why he was was at fault for getting shot:
Quote:
ICE agents are now trigger friendly . Anything that they suspect will harm them will result in lethal force. Knowing that, why would anyone with a brain try to protest with a concealed weapon against them. They should assume that ICE agents are idiots and pussies in the first place.
You say you’re not blaming the victim, but focusing on what he did “wrong” still shifts the spotlight away from the people who actually chose lethal force.
Reading the rest of your comments, it's like you're saying on one hand people should respect law enforcement, but then also saying ICE is incompetent.
If law enforcement is incompetent but also people should stay out of their way and do what they say, it sounds like you're saying you support the idea of law enforcement by intimidation, not proper training and competence.
It suggests that trigger-happy cops are just something they should live with. That's absurd. These are supposed to be trained law enforcement agents. The expectation should be higher on them, not on ordinary people to perfectly predict their reactions.
I think you’re right that two things can be true: ICE can have a role, and ICE can be handling this badly.
But you're basically saying instead of ICE being better, citizens should just shut up and get out of their way to avoid getting killed.
I think that's a scary way to think. People of Minnesota are protesting the actions of their government, and they should stand down when the gov't response to the protests is essentially brute force and acting like thugs. That's like what happened in Iran.
Which if that's what you think is ok and that the residents should know better, that's fine. Just say that.
It should be noted that the tank man at the Tiananmen Square protests was given more courtesy by the tank driver (he tried to go around the protestor) than the courtesy ICE has been giving observers so far.
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