REVscene Automotive Forum - Ethiopian Airlines crash kills all 157 on board, 18 Canadians

REVscene Automotive Forum (https://www.revscene.net/forums/)

- Vancouver Off-Topic / Current Events (https://www.revscene.net/forums/vancouver-off-topic-current-events_50/)

- - Ethiopian Airlines crash kills all 157 on board, 18 Canadians (https://www.revscene.net/forums/715939-ethiopian-airlines-crash-kills-all-157-board-18-canadians.html)

if the carriers are still buying them/not cancelling contracts, then sure why not keep building them

just surprised some the carriers haven't taken this as an opportunity to end their purchase contracts

Quote:

Originally Posted by belka (Post 8969179)

The MCAS software was fixed months ago..

So what's the hold up, then?

Quote:

Originally Posted by blkgsr (Post 8969192)

Dubai air show was only two weeks ago and I’m pretty sure I watched some videos saying there were like, hundreds of additional orders there

I’d say the worst case scenario for these hold ups is if the issue is mechanical. Then you’re going to have this whole grounded fleet needing to be retro fit on site

They are years behind on orders. Need to keep making them, which is why stopping production is such a massive headline. It’s not easy to get out of the purchase contracts. The carrot dangling “were very close, only a few months away,” makes any large decision like a fleet change a huuuge decision. If they said it was going to be 1.5 years+, things would have been completely different.

This is all about everyone covering there own asses now. No one wants to be liable, this take a ton of time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by whitev70r (Post 8969156)

I don't understand what the hell is taking so long to fix the 737's ... I mean if it is hardware, change the damn sensor/part. If it is software, surely, someone has the right coding now.

With aviation there's so much testing and certifying involved in every system, code, part, down to each rivet. A 99.99% reliability rate on the MCAS would still be the equivalent of a crash a day. That's what makes planes so expensive, making them "aviation-grade"

From what I read, while fixing the MCAS they found more software bugs, and are fixing those and getting the fix certified.

Software development... 99 bugs on the wall, 99 bugs, squash one, pass it around, 127 bugs on the wall!

Boeing has been forced to halt production because they no longer have anywhere to store the jets. Boeing field and portions of Seatac are FULL of them. I think I heard the number that inside/outside Boeing there are something like 200 jets that are complete but can't be delivered because they can't be flown out, even to paint. There's literally nowhere else to house all the aircraft, they're even in the car parking lots now. The MCAS investigation opened a can of worms within Boeing and numerous issues with the aircraft have been unearthed. Until they're all resolved and the aircraft are ungrounded and can start clearing out Boeing's production will be shut down.

https://i.imgur.com/kuUEdYo.jpg

I am just waiting for BA to dip below 300. :fuckthatshit:

I suspect it's when the whole shitshow is going to end, including the compensation to families... etc

So you guys may e heard that the max was cleared for use again in the USA and Brazil has an airline flying em again, but here's another recent bit o news

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55372499

Quote:

Boeing 'inappropriately coached' pilots during 737 Max recertification, U.S. Senate report says

Report says officials attempted to cover up information that may have contributed to fatal crashes
Thomson Reuters · Posted: Dec 18, 2020 8:55 PM ET | Last Updated: December 18
Boeing officials "inappropriately coached" test pilots during recertification efforts after two fatal 737 Max crashes, according to a lengthy U.S. government report released on Friday.

The report from the Senate commerce committee said testing of a key safety system known as MCAS tied to both fatal crashes was contrary to proper protocol.

The committee concluded Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) and Boeing officials "had established a pre-determined outcome to reaffirm a long-held human factor assumption related to pilot reaction time.... It appears, in this instance, FAA and Boeing were attempting to cover up important information that may have contributed to the 737 Max tragedies."

All Max planes were grounded worldwide after crashes in Indonesia and Ethiopia killed a total of 346 people in October 2018 and March 2019, respectively. Last month, the FAA approved the 737 Max's return to service, and flights have resumed in Brazil. The first U.S. 737 Max commercial flight with paying passengers is set for Dec. 29.

According to a whistleblower who was an FAA safety inspector, Boeing representatives watched and gave advice to help test pilots in a flight simulator respond to a nose-down pitch of the plane in a few seconds. The reaction of three flight crews was still slower than Boeing had assumed, according to the report. Each time the plane would have been thrown into a nose-down pitch, although recovery would have been possible, the investigators said.

In the two Max crashes, a failure of the MCAS pushed the nose down repeatedly, sending the planes into fatal dives.

The FAA countered that it was an FAA pilot who discovered a separate computer issue in the plane, a flaw that took Boeing additional months to fix.

Investigators also said an FAA division manager was first invited, then excluded from a review of the Max crashes even though his position normally would call for him to participate in the review. The official said he believes he was excluded to shield the FAA from criticism.

Numerous reports have found Boeing failed to adequately consider how pilots respond to cockpit emergencies in its development of the 737 Max.

Boeing said Friday it takes "seriously the committee's findings and will continue to review the report in full."The FAA said Friday it was "carefully reviewing the document, which the committee acknowledges contains a number of unsubstantiated allegations."

The agency added that it is "confident that the safety issues that played a role in the tragic [737 Max] accidents involving Lion Air Flight 610 and Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302 have been addressed through the design changes required and independently approved by the FAA and its partners."

'Lapses in aviation safety oversight'
Senate commerce committee chair Roger Wicker said the report "details a number of significant examples of lapses in aviation safety oversight and failed leadership in the FAA."

The committee also said "multiple independent whistleblowers contacted the committee to allege FAA senior management was complicit in determining the 737 Max training certification level prior to any evaluation."

Boeing resisted requiring simulator training for pilots before operating the 737 Max but reversed course in January.

The report also noted Southwest Airlines was able to operate more than 150,000 flights carrying 17.2 million passengers on jets without confirmation that required maintenance had been completed.

The Senate report said the Southwest flights "put millions of passengers at potential risk." Southwest did not immediately comment. Southwest said Friday it was aware of the report and added "we do not tolerate any relaxing of standards that govern ultimate safety across our operation."

Victims' families tell MPs Boeing 737 Max should stay grounded for now
Boeing still faces an ongoing criminal probe into the Max. The committee said its review was "constrained due to the continued criminal investigation"

Last month, the Senate committee unanimously passed a bill to reform how FAA certifies new airplanes and grant new protections for whistleblowers, among other reforms, while the U.S. House of Representatives unanimously passed a similar bill.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/boe...port-1.5848305