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Realistically (and unfortunately), a household with only $74k annual income shouldn't be buying new vehicles in this day and age. It is just far too expensive to afford.
Going by the 20/4/10 rule:
- 20% down
- finance for no more than 4 years
- keep total vehicle expense under 10% of (monthly) gross income
$74k annual gross income means:
- $6167 monthly gross income
- 10% of above = $616.77
To make the calculations easy, let's just say the monthy payments are going to be $400/month. That means $216.77 is spent on gas and insurance, which is already kind of unrealistic.
I punched the numbers into Edmund's affordability calculator, and I'm getting:
- $4k down payment
- vehicle price range of $18k - $20k
Incidentally through the EV grapevine again, someone mentioned / leaked a bunch of estimated landed prices for the BYD line up for the N.American market (whatever that means), and they are as follows, with all figures in CDN:
So I guess the median Canadian household will be buying a BYD Dolphin as their next car?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by westopher
The whole world has gone down a road no one can recover from, and it's nothing to do with governments, it's because so much of the general public is so fucking stupid.
I know nothing about this Pirelli PZero AS+ 3, but from looking at just the tread pattern, it looks 100% like a grand touring tire instead of a high performance all season.
Total Overall Rating: 7.38/10
Watt Hours per Mile: 276
Range at 100% Charge: 250
Another EV-focused variant of a popular existing choice, the Elect branding is how Pirelli distinguishes their EV specific tires. On the road, it delivered a comfortable and composed ride for a UHPAS, handling both small undulations and big impacts with ease, though some impact noise was more noticeable than the actual feel. Noise levels were generally low across all surfaces, with minimal tread noise and subdued volume on concrete and coarse asphalt, even if it didn't quite match the quietest tires in the group. Steering felt natural and predictable - more in line with a touring tire than a sharp performance product - but still responsive enough to feel confident on the road. It was competitive with some of the more efficient tires in the test at 276 Wh/mi, a good baseline.
The P Zero AS Plus 3 (Elect) performed well in wet conditions, not quite top-tier overall, but on par with some of the strongest competitors. It offered confident braking and responsive front-end behavior, with a sense of eagerness in helping the car turn without feeling unnatural. Though it did move around slightly under heavy throttle, it remained predictable and communicative at the limit, making it easy to drive confidently. The dry track experience was in the same vein, but the steering in particular felt magnified - more so than in the wet - as if the tire was boosting each input, helping it turn just a little further. It wasn't so much that it could be an issue, though it did make it feel a touch less accurate, harder to dial in exactly where it needed to be.
Winter conditions were much less kind to the P Zero AS Plus 3 (Elect). Getting through laps required constant management, working one corner at a time, feeding in countersteer, keeping the rear in check, and being careful with throttle. Making any kind of meaningful progress felt more akin to surviving the track than driving it, with no real standout traits to lean on. The car got tossed around easily, demanding frequent steering corrections, and never settled into a confident or composed rhythm. In addition, it took over 60 feet to come to a stop from 12 mph on the ice.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by westopher
The whole world has gone down a road no one can recover from, and it's nothing to do with governments, it's because so much of the general public is so fucking stupid.
Realistically (and unfortunately), a household with only $74k annual income shouldn't be buying new vehicles in this day and age. It is just far too expensive to afford.
Going by the 20/4/10 rule:
- 20% down
- finance for no more than 4 years
- keep total vehicle expense under 10% of (monthly) gross income
$74k annual gross income means:
- $6167 monthly gross income
- 10% of above = $616.77
To make the calculations easy, let's just say the monthy payments are going to be $400/month. That means $216.77 is spent on gas and insurance, which is already kind of unrealistic.
Out of curiosity, I plugged your numbers in for the '26 Solterra on the mfg website: 20% downpayment, 4 year financing.
Came out to $660/mo over 4 years (0.5% financing ftw). That's not that far off! I really think a heavily incentivized cheap EV is the best way to go for ultimate frugality, so long as someone has access to a wall socket at home or a charger at work so they're not paying much to charge.
The issue with buying an older car is that these people could really get hosed by random unexpected repair costs that you can't defer (since it's probably their only car). I keep thinking back to my CPO '08 GTI w/ 70k kms on it that needed an entire engine replacement. Or my subsequent '08 Mini Cooper S with 35k miles on it - not under warranty but what could go wrong at 35k miles? - immediately needed a clutch replacement ($4k USD due to how complicated it is to do on these cars), and then random knocking, and then also a leaking turbo, which I got quoted thousands of dollars more to fix, at which point I noped the fk outta there.
And especially on an older ICE vehicle, there's all the regular maintenance you have to be really on top of or it makes things even worse. For people in the general public, they probably don't have the knowledge or tools to be able to do their own maintenance work, which means paying for those $1000 brake jobs (barely ever on an EV due to regen braking) and $500 fluid flushes.
__________________ Geriatric Motoring Club Member #37
Quote:
Originally Posted by EvoFire
I need to be reliably within 10-15mins of a baked pork chops rice with lemon tea.
Need to Shave n Shower, but I CANT STOP POSTING ON RS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RabidRat
The issue with buying an older car is that these people could really get hosed by random unexpected repair costs that you can't defer (since it's probably their only car). I keep thinking back to my CPO '08 GTI w/ 70k kms on it that needed an entire engine replacement. Or my subsequent '08 Mini Cooper S with 35k miles on it - not under warranty but what could go wrong at 35k miles? - immediately needed a clutch replacement ($4k USD due to how complicated it is to do on these cars), and then random knocking, and then also a leaking turbo, which I got quoted thousands of dollars more to fix, at which point I noped the fk outta there..
That sounds more like a Euro issue than an older car issue. 70k and 35k aren't even "older", anyone commuting hits that pretty quickly.
__________________ 1991 Toyota Celica GTFour RC // 2007 Toyota Rav4 V6 // 2000 Jeep Grand Cherokee
1992 Toyota Celica GT-S ["sold"] \\ 2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee CRD [sold] \\ 2000 Jeep Cherokee [sold] \\ 1997 Honda Prelude [sold] \\ 1992 Jeep YJ [sold/crashed] \\ 1987 Mazda RX-7 [sold] \\ 1987 Toyota Celica GT-S [crushed]
Quote:
Originally Posted by maksimizer
half those dudes are hotter than ,my GF.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RevYouUp
reading this thread is like waiting for goku to charge up a spirit bomb in dragon ball z
Quote:
Originally Posted by Good_KarMa
OH thank god. I thought u had sex with my wife. :cry:
Rat seems to have no luck when it comes to used cars. he's the only guy with a faulty toyota hybrid that ive heard of. Nobody else has hybrid problems, not even my dad's old ass, first generation hybrid SUV RX400h from 2008 with 250,000kms on the clock.
That sounds more like a Euro issue than an older car issue. 70k and 35k aren't even "older", anyone commuting hits that pretty quickly.
100% agreed. Given my Euro ownership, I would liken that my experience is "mild" compared to what you read on the internet and nowhere near RabidRat's experiences. The "problems" I've experience are typically old car problems due to wear and tear, and stuff like that, but nowhere near engine or clutch replacements etc.
I'm still shocked that our 04 Mini Cooper S is running at 332,000KMs. I think it's due for a fuel injector o-ring replacement though.
I posted this a while back, but last year, my brother was fully stopped at a red light. Some lady in an SUV smashes into the Mini and it hit the curb pretty hard, damaging some suspension and cracked the plastic fender pieces etc.
Total repair job was $3500 parts and labour. Parts couldn't be overnighted from Germany either. They wouldn't write it off.
Or, you could just stop beating around the busy and directly tell me to die in a fire you asshole.
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