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Old 04-25-2012, 10:45 AM   #28526
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Originally Posted by Tj.GSR View Post
but oh wait he said he will get rid of his NTC if MG asks him to do so. i think both goalies know that only one is staying and to say otherwise is a Bold statment.
I think what Lu said about waiving his NTC is him totally understanding the situation. It doesn't mean that he isn't willing to split the net with Cory. I see it to mean that if the Canucks want to move forward longterm with Cory as the guy, Lu would be willing to do what is needed to make that happen and not handcuff the team. Obviously he won't be content with playing 25 games while Cory plays 65 games, but that isn't something that will happen if they both stay. Total class act move IMO

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Originally Posted by fliptuner View Post
Hey, you never know. Good athletes always want the ball/puck but more importantly, they want to win. Lu even said it was hard to sit while Schneids played but still supported the decision and vice-versa. All season long, they both wanted to play, so they're always hungry to win when they get the chance.

They're both great goalies and if they believe they can split the season and come out with a cup, I think they go for it. If the cap goes up, as expected, I think it's totally feasable to get Schneids in at 3-3.5m. I think all that's needed is management to convince them that they'll get the right skaters in front of them to produce and support the D.
That's the same thought that I've had since earlier this year. 1 more year as a tandem, 1 more kick at the can. If it doesn't work out, then they will make the moves next year.

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They are both big ticket players that we can use to negotiate a sweet deal with.
I don't think the return will be as sweet as everybody hopes and expects. There are other good solid goalie options available throughout the league. I would be surprised if Lu returns more than a solid mid-level player and a draft pick because of his contract. Cory, as great as he is, is still unproven as a starter and there have been instances where it takes a while for his potential to materialize, if it does at all (best example Mike Smith basically run out of Tampa. I bet Stevie Y wishes he didn't let Smith walk, at only 2M/yr). Because of that, I think Cory may be return a 3-4 d-man and a draft pick/prospect or 2, but probably not much more than that. With either of these deals, aside from freeing up some cap space, is the return worth what you know you are giving up in net, since Lack is reportedly 'close' to NHL ready but not yet.

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Just like Grabner, I believe CoHo has the skillset that you just can't learn and practice through training and conditioning and yes, that does come with some baggage.

Had he obtained a return more favourable to the Canucks, this wouldn't be an issue today.
I totally agree about the skillset. But being a successful player goes well above just having the skills. We like to use Grabner as an example, but what is he really? He scored 34g 2 years ago, had 20g last year and was -18... the Islanders picked him up off waivers from the Panthers, to help put things into perspective. Had Grabner stayed with the Canucks, he'd be likely playing for the Wolves still. I agree that Kassian was brought in for toughness and size for the short term, but I don't think management is overly surprised or disappointed that didn't materialize this year. If he did all of that, I think they would have been pleasantly surprised.

Doug Maclean was on 1040 yesterday and he was well aware of Coho's trade demands. You can bet the GM's who had assets the Canucks were interested in were aware of Coho's availability. The ones who didn't know, probably didn't have anything of interest to offer us in return for Coho

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The only reason we're having this convo is cuz he's simply being outplayed by a younger cheaper goalie.
I don't think Cory's sample size of work is big enough to determine that he has outplayed Lu over the course of a full season. I love the way Cory plays and the way he conducts himself. But let's face reality, if Lu was in net for the same 2 goals that Cory gave up on game 5, Lu would have been absolutely crucified.

I am curious to see if anything happens with Kesler this offseason. He obviously had an off year with his hip and shoulder, but I think he has a good bounce back next year. Not 41g good, but definite improvement on this year. The intriguing part is that he is an asset that can bring in some big returns, and his NTC doesn't kick in until July. What sort of player can work well with Kesler, playmaking winger?
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Old 04-25-2012, 10:49 AM   #28527
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Im surprised novody mentioned a Kesler for Staal trade lol
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Old 04-25-2012, 10:51 AM   #28528
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lol if lu is trolling because he knows where MG stands with regard to asking players to waive their NTC this would be so well played because it wouldn't make him look like the bad guy

Mike Gillis: I will never ask a player to waive his NTC
Luongo: I'll waive it if MG asks me to...I don't want to be selfish......
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Old 04-25-2012, 10:55 AM   #28529
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i'm kind of 60/40 on the whole trade kesler thing. i mean.. you don't just trade a selke winning centre after a SINGLE bad season which was preceded by hip surgery and a shoulder injury in February..

on the other hand, his diving, chirping, and apparent unwillingness to pass to his wingers were all detrimental to the team. but is this really enough to trade the guy away? if he can just play like he did last year and last year's playoffs, he'll be fine.

i think gillis/av need to show him that toews video again. in fact, there was a report that kesler (and burrows/lappy, i believe) to just shut up and play.
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:02 AM   #28530
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Interesting article on sheltering Cody.

Can we pinpoint when the Canucks started sheltering Cody Hodgson? | CanucksArmy
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:21 AM   #28531
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i'm kind of 60/40 on the whole trade kesler thing. i mean.. you don't just trade a selke winning centre after a SINGLE bad season which was preceded by hip surgery and a shoulder injury in February..

on the other hand, his diving, chirping, and apparent unwillingness to pass to his wingers were all detrimental to the team. but is this really enough to trade the guy away? if he can just play like he did last year and last year's playoffs, he'll be fine.

i think gillis/av need to show him that toews video again. in fact, there was a report that kesler (and burrows/lappy, i believe) to just shut up and play.
I love Kesler at times, and can't stand him at other times. There are those who feel Kesler makes a better captain than Hank because he is more emotionally invested, seems to 'show' more heart as a result. I can't help but disagree, Kesler is quite polarized. At his best, he can be a great leader with his on-ice play. At his worst, his antics are on par with Lappiere, not exactly something I want from a leader of the team, goes and sulks in the corner, not great with the media when he isn't bombing interviews, so he needs some work before he can be a good captain. Overall, his inconsistency here is something that needs to be addressed before he can become respected as a great player; he has shown that he possesses the tools to do it though.

I'm not for or against trading him. Like I mentioned I believe this season was an anomaly and he will bounce back and be a great player. But if he doesn't move before July, then he becomes unmoveable for the next 4 seasons. I don't think MG is actively looking to get rid of him, but this does provide an interesting opportunity and I wonder why his NTC didn't kick in from the beginning of his new contract. I think he can bring back an equal or greater return if he does get moved, and can change up the mix in the room for the better.
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:34 AM   #28532
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lightening the mood a bit..this is kinda funny...in a sadistic sorta way..

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Old 04-25-2012, 11:36 AM   #28533
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Im surprised novody mentioned a Kesler for Staal trade lol
luongo + kesler to pitts for staal and MA fleury then acquire malone or clowe for fleury
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:38 AM   #28534
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Unless we get a superstar in return, I'm really against trading Kesler. Although Kesler sucked this year, there are only a handful of guys who can do what he can, which is play gritty, awesome defence and chip in offensively - guys like Toews, Backes, Patrice Bergeron, Jordan Staal, Mike Richards, Mikko Koivu, Pavelski, Zajac, etc.

I have full confidence that if he gets a long summer to recover, he will be a solid 30 goal, 60 - 70 point selke caliber center for the next few years.
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:46 AM   #28535
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the hell.. hodgson? did you forget you got the 2 sedins on our team

mind boggling passes.. puck possession finesse
No I didn't forget that. The Canucks went from having three scoring lines to a checking line and two scoring lines, hence changing the identity of the team.
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:47 AM   #28536
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Here is Elloit Friedmad's take on the Canucks situation:

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It's easy to look at Roberto Luongo's contract, see the 10 years remaining and say, "Good luck, Vancouver. You won't be able to trade him anywhere."

That's not necessarily true.

Jeff Carter's 11-year deal was traded twice in eight months.

The biggest factors in Luongo's case may turn out to be how much the Canucks want for him and/or what other goalies are available this summer, but here's how a market could develop:

Go through the NHL lineup. Forget his contract for a minute and just count how many teams would be better off if he played goal for them. The reason you forget the contract at the beginning is that some NHL general managers prefer to imagine the player on their roster before thinking about the financials.

That way, you decide whether or not it's worth the aggravation of figuring out how to fit him under the cap. If you don't like the guy enough, you won't bother.

Depending on your like or dislike for Luongo, there are between five and nine teams. That list undoubtedly includes what you'd expect are his top two destinations: Tampa Bay and Florida, although the Panthers have uberprospect Jacob Markstrom.

I know all you Toronto Maple Leafs lovers want to jump in here. My guess? He'd prefer someplace quieter, but it should be pointed out that Luongo has a great relationship with goaltending coach Francois Allaire -- assuming Allaire isn't quitting.

Regardless, there are teams who are going to look at Luongo and say, "He could help us."

CONTRACT COULD BE WORTH IT

Yes, Luongo has 10 years left on a 12-year deal. The most expensive season of that contract -- $10 million US in 2010-11 -- is behind him. In 2011-12, he earned $6.716 million. That's, basically, what he'll make in each of the next six seasons. The salary drop off doesn't come until 2018-19, when he'll be 39 (maybe there's a rollback in the new CBA, but who knows?).

So if you want Luongo, you must be prepared to commit $40.3 million over the next six years. Teams like Toronto or Chicago, if interested, can handle the cash payout no problem. For lower-revenue clubs, it's tougher.

Last year, I had a lengthy conversation with an NHL executive about this kind of contract and what would make it appealing for another team to take.

"You're going to be interested if he can add to your revenue," he said. "For example, if you're out of the playoffs, do you think he can get you there?

"If so, how much will more playoff home dates add to your bottom line? An improved team also increases your season-ticket sales, concessions, merchandise sales, everything. If you think he can do that for you, his contract would be worthwhile."

That's why I'm curious to see if Tampa Bay Lightning GM Steve Yzerman is a player in this. Yzerman saw Luongo up close at the 2010 Vancouver Olympics and, given the Lightning's goaltending issues of last season, he would definitely be an improvement.

Luongo handled the last couple of weeks extremely well, playing the good soldier, even though he clearly understood what was coming. And the Canucks know dropping Game 1 -- even though he played great -- was a major reason they lost their first-round playoff series to the Los Angeles Kings. I wouldn't be surprised if there are a few teams who think he'll thrive when he isn't the provincial scapegoat.

There are lots of questions here: Will a trade partner want the Canucks to take back a salary? Is Vancouver prepared to accept what doesn't look like a great "hockey deal" simply to open cap room? And, most importantly, how will the potential availability of Jonathan Bernier, Tim Thomas, Miikka Kiprusoff and/or a St. Louis goalie affect the market?

It's going to take a little while. But in the end, teams are going to take a long look at Luongo.

30 THOUGHTS

1. There are very good reasons for Luongo to willingly give up his no-trade. If the Canucks wanted to be absolutely ruthless -- and I don't believe they do -- they could put him on waivers next season. There is also the gamble of a contract amnesty or less-favourable buyout rules for a player in the next CBA. Smart for Luongo to play it this way.

2. The other variable here is restricted free agent Cory Schneider. Vancouver would probably love him at Carey Price's 2011-12 salary of $2.75 million. But Steve Mason's $2.9-million cap hit probably pushes it higher. Schneider's a great team guy who patiently waited for this chance. How easily does it get done?

3. There were some reports the Canucks can block a potential offer sheet for Schneider by offering him arbitration just after the Stanley Cup final (Nashville did this last season with Shea Weber). Don't believe that is true. Because Schneider earned less than $1.5 million, no action can be taken before July 5. If he and the team cannot get something signed beforehand, he will be exposed for a few days.

4. In the March 6 edition of this blog, I mentioned that Vancouver "targeted" a few players in a possible Cody Hodgson deal. Zack Kassian was one, obviously. I also noted Brandon Sutter, who the Carolina Hurricanes love, and made an educated guess at John Carlson (which appears to be true). Canucks GM Mike Gillis said Tuesday there were six players. According to a couple of sources, sounds like the fourth was Erik Gudbranson and the fifth Kyle Clifford. No. 6? Not sure.

5. Gillis, who has one more year on his contract, talked about his own future at his season-ending media conference and a meeting he'll have next week with Canucks owner Francesco Aquilini. Gillis revealed that a friend of his died recently and there was a rumour that he may choose to step down and take a break. In a very brief phone conversation Monday night, he said that is not the case (I know people are going to think he talked about some of the other stuff discussed here, but it isn't the case. He only agreed to speak on that issue).

6. Last word on Canucks: Gillis really stood up for head coach Alain Vigneault and it's clear his preference is to keep him. Still think, though, the coaching situation isn't 100 per cent settled until the two men really sit down talk about the future. What if they have different ideas about personnel or strategy moving forward?

7. Montreal Canadiens fans are drooling about the possibility of a Vigneault return but, if he isn't in Vancouver, I'd be shocked if Edmonton doesn't take a run at him.
Rest of this 30 thoughts can be found here:

Luongo trade talk + 30 Thoughts | Hockey | CBC Sports
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:49 AM   #28537
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Very surprised and unwise that MG aired out dirty laundry in public. Defensive and taking the low road for sure. People would be leery to trade with him hearing what he said. The timing of the trade was bad as well and he didn't shop him league wide.
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Old 04-25-2012, 11:51 AM   #28538
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who do we even want from chicago? kane / hossa?
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:08 PM   #28539
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who do we even want from chicago? kane / hossa?
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:09 PM   #28540
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bolland said he wouldnt allow any canuck on their team
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:13 PM   #28541
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It's not going to happen but I'd want Toews. Guy is my favorite non-Canuck player.
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:28 PM   #28542
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bolland said he wouldnt allow any canuck on their team
Brendan Morrison is playing for them.
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:43 PM   #28543
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I hope the canucks keep luongo so he can win a cup in vancouver make all the haters stfu. We're not that far from it... Send cory to SJ for one of their top 6 and aquire defencemen with the extra money we have after shipping mayray and ballard out + forcing manny into retirement.
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:51 PM   #28544
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Old 04-25-2012, 12:57 PM   #28545
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Very surprised and unwise that MG aired out dirty laundry in public. Defensive and taking the low road for sure. People would be leery to trade with him hearing what he said. The timing of the trade was bad as well and he didn't shop him league wide.
He wasn't going to shop Cody to the whole league, as per MG he would only trade Cody for 6 players. One of them being Zack.
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:24 PM   #28546
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I hope the canucks keep luongo so he can win a cup in vancouver make all the haters stfu. We're not that far from it... Send cory to SJ for one of their top 6 and aquire defencemen with the extra money we have after shipping mayray and ballard out + forcing manny into retirement.
Mason isn't going anywhere, as per MG.
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:31 PM   #28547
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LUNDQVIST, QUICK, RINNE NOMINATED FOR VEZINA TROPHY



my vote is for lundqvist.
quick will win....easily
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:37 PM   #28548
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Yup, my money's on Quick as well.
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:52 PM   #28549
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I can't wait till the playoffs are over and it's nearing the draft, we can see what trades or signing or waht's going to happen.

Since we are out early...imagine we luck out and draft a Sean Couturier?
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:54 PM   #28550
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