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Old 10-07-2011, 06:03 PM   #76
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BTW, today on global news they said the lower mainlands unemployment rate is only 3.5%

and maybe if that chick above had taken a degree where it would have been worthwhile to take out loans etc. to get through school she wouldn't be in that predicament, bitching about having to drop out of an arts degree..

while travelling i met a girl from Virginia who was on her way to law school, she was in her 4th overall year of studies out of 6-7 potential years she would be doing, at this point in her 4th year she was $65,000 into her student loans, HOWEVER, speaking with financial planners and government staff she learned that if she was to take her law school training into the public sector, virtually all of her student loan would be void as a public servant, her good planning and long-term outlook will most likely land her a good paying career with smart choices and planning.. not something the majority of people in school seem to choose to do..

I love seeing this stupid stories on the news lately about people with "families" moving back east because of housing prices, cost of living, etc. the first thing that comes to my mind is, Maybe you should have tried a little harder?

or.. maybe you couldnt afford to have a child at this point in your life?..

are normal hard-working people suppose to have sympathy for these stories of mass-exodus from the west coast due to cost of living between a family of 2 barista's trying to raise a child?

EDIT* Also like Penner2k has pointed out in a thread right here in VanOT, if your bitching about cost of living or cant get a job that gets you anywhere, go work in Alberta in the oil industry, saving up 80k over a couple years of work is more than enough to put down for a home, or even an investment property to further your finances, but of course, and especially here on RS, people rather complain then get their hands dirty.
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Old 10-07-2011, 09:01 PM   #77
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She is but one example if you look at the rest of the 99% people there are lots with real degrees, infact I've only seen one person on that site with an arts degree complaining about being unemployed.
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BTW, today on global news they said the lower mainlands unemployment rate is only 3.5%

and maybe if that chick above had taken a degree where it would have been worthwhile to take out loans etc. to get through school she wouldn't be in that predicament, bitching about having to drop out of an arts degree..

while travelling i met a girl from Virginia who was on her way to law school, she was in her 4th overall year of studies out of 6-7 potential years she would be doing, at this point in her 4th year she was $65,000 into her student loans, HOWEVER, speaking with financial planners and government staff she learned that if she was to take her law school training into the public sector, virtually all of her student loan would be void as a public servant, her good planning and long-term outlook will most likely land her a good paying career with smart choices and planning.. not something the majority of people in school seem to choose to do..

I love seeing this stupid stories on the news lately about people with "families" moving back east because of housing prices, cost of living, etc. the first thing that comes to my mind is, Maybe you should have tried a little harder?

or.. maybe you couldnt afford to have a child at this point in your life?..

are normal hard-working people suppose to have sympathy for these stories of mass-exodus from the west coast due to cost of living between a family of 2 barista's trying to raise a child?

EDIT* Also like Penner2k has pointed out in a thread right here in VanOT, if your bitching about cost of living or cant get a job that gets you anywhere, go work in Alberta in the oil industry, saving up 80k over a couple years of work is more than enough to put down for a home, or even an investment property to further your finances, but of course, and especially here on RS, people rather complain then get their hands dirty.
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Old 10-07-2011, 10:30 PM   #78
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For anyone that didnt grow up in a poor family. It is extremely hard to do what many of you more fortunate individuals want the poor to do.

Lets see, you want the poor, to go rack up large student loans and get "non-Arts" degrees, to compete in the job market where if you are lucky to land a job, you will get paid peanuts, so corporations can make record profits and again, benefit the 1%???

In the US, there are many students with computer science and business degrees or other "non-Artss" degrees with mounting student debt, that graduate to find very few jobs in the field that they study, and they end taking construction jobs or "barista jobs". Now you are working a job with shiet pay and you have huge debt. You're doing this why others are calling you LAZY. Can you see why these people are frustrated???

Hell, even here in Vancouver, many students are going through recruitment and cant find jobs in their fields.

Not to mention the social issues like, how the poor dont have educated parents to teach them skills that the rich teach their kids, in addition to the hookups that their parents can offer them. Its much more difficult for poor kids to compete against the more fortunate kids that have parents that are VPs or Partners or Directors at some of these corporations. Again, there are some that do make it into the decent paying jobs, but it is a much more difficult path.

I'm just using the student example since majority of RS is younger.
I know many people that worked in the corporate finance industry who got laid off in 2008, and cant find similar jobs here in Vancouver, they have kids that go to school here and thus makes moving difficult. Hence finding another lower paying job.

Back to being poor, when you are poor, you dont have the support groups that can help you get out of this shietty social class. Many corporations, wealthy individuals and lobbyists wish to Reduce taxes (to increase their profits!) and reduce social spending. Spending on education, school programs and social programs that supports you and help you to become a productive member of society.

Also when you are poor, you dont hang out with guys golfing at the country club, you are susceptible to gangs and such. You join gangs, commit crimes, and go to jail. Where lobbyists want you to have a longer sentence for petty crime, even though it costs taxpayers $$millions to house these inviduals in the prison, and who are they paying??? Corporations. Corporations profit from people going to jail. But no, they don't want to spend more on social programs that keep kids from trouble after school or other prevention programs.

When you are poor, frustrated and unemployed, you have nothing to lose, so I can see why many people are protesting.

corporations have a right to make a profit, but not a right to fuck the average person up the ass. It boggles my mind that former Monsanto execs or Bank execs that fck up the system become the people that regulate it. The majority of political contributions come from large conglomerates.
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Old 10-07-2011, 10:33 PM   #79
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All poor people need is a physical, drug test, OSSA orient, and CSTS training totalling $300 or completely covered and your making $65,000 a year in alberta, excuses not included.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:24 PM   #80
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^Moving to Alberta and taking a job as a mindless labourer with no future or family life shouldn't be the only option for decent paying employment.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:33 PM   #81
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nothing wrong w being mindless for a couple of years to make enough $$ to get your life back in order.

You have choices.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:46 PM   #82
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nothing wrong w being mindless for a couple of years to make enough $$ to get your life back in order.

You have choices.
Not everyone is cut out to work in a tough environment like the tar sands.
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Old 10-07-2011, 11:53 PM   #83
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Not everyone is cut out to work in a tough environment like the tar sands.
Exactly. Some people do not have the physical capabilities to work there even if they wanted to. Those camps arent the most hospitable place for the average women either.

When almost 10% of the population is unemployed like in the US, you cant solely blame the individual.

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that the system is fucked when the wealthiest country on the planet allows the top 1% to own the majority of that wealth.
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Old 10-08-2011, 12:10 AM   #84
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21 year old girls work for suncore in fort mac...
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Old 10-08-2011, 01:26 AM   #85
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I think people need to understand that today's market is a global market.

I think people have a right to work and make a living. Nobody should be starving. And they aren't, at least not in Canada (if you of able mind and body).

However, that right does not extend to you making a living in any city you choose. Some cities are more competitive than others or requiring a different skill set. Some cities may have a higher cost of living (Vancouver is a prime example). Some may be more labor intensive or more education higher thinking intensive.

Much like how the poor have a right to affordable accommodations, they don't really have a right to it wherever they choose. The Athletes Village or Woodwards building is a prime example of this. There are things in life you can't have simply because you are priced out.

If you can't afford to live in one of the most expensive cities in the world because you lack the skills to thrive there, then maybe you can work manual labor on a farm in the prairie provinces.

I can't stand people saying "i have a right to blah blah blah in such and such a place". Because they don't.


Also.
People with kids, that's a life choice. If a wife and husband work at mcdonalds and walmart and decide they want 2 children, they are making a poor life choice. Then don't buy a TV, then don't buy a car. Those things aren't rights.



It's all about choices.
Once again, if you are both of able mind and body, I have yet to see a lack of opportunity in the first world as long as you are willing to use a little elbow grease.
It's like people in the States not wanting to do labor jobs being taken by immigrants, but still complaining they are no jobs available.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:36 AM   #86
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nothing wrong w being mindless for a couple of years to make enough $$ to get your life back in order.

You have choices.
Return to what?

A low paying dead end job, because being a mindless bitch doesn't exactly develop marketable skills. I wouldn't hire someone who spent two years in the oil sands because they're greedy and were willing to do anything for a high short term income, someone who spent a few years developing skills would be a much better candidate for any position at any level.

In reality, this movement isn't about people expecting to make a high income at a entry level position, it's about the pay differential between rich and poor. Nothing should make the CEO of a company entitled to 475 times the average income of the employees of the same company, a person should simply be entitled to a liveable wage at all income levels and in any region.

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Old 10-08-2011, 03:19 AM   #87
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... a person should simply be entitled to a liveable wage at all income levels and in any region.
I disagree with this. Why do you believe they are entitled it in any region?

Some jobs just don't pay well and some cities are more expensive.
It's not even stemming from a corrupt system. It's just nature. Not all things are equal, and sometimes, somewhere, being the top of the ladder isn't so far from the bottom. But sometimes, being at the bottom really sucks.

Living in Saskatchewan definitely cheaper than if you lived in Point Grey, North Shore, London, New York or Coal Harbour.
Why should a janitor be entitled to a wage that supports him living wherever he chooses? It's a simple reality that he is priced out of some regions. It's not an issue of corruption.


It's like being a house cat. In a person's house, they have cute skills that gets them food.
As an alley cat, it would have to rummage through garbage. It's fairly suitable to this.
In the savannah, it wouldn't last 10 days. It neither has the cunning, fortitude size or skills.
It's not fair, but that cat isn't entitled to a damn thing. Don't pretend that it is.


I have nothing against your argument as a whole, i find the ever growing disparity a sure tell of a broken system, but I just thought I should nip bad logic in the bud before it spirals out of control.
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Old 10-08-2011, 07:05 AM   #88
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21 year old girls work for suncore in fort mac...
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And how many non-white people work up there? I've spent time in the Peace (which is our oil country) and it's white as snow in terms of the people and culture. (aside from First Nations of course.)

I somewhat agree that you have to go where the jobs are. But on the other hand, when you grow up in an environment where your background, your "manhood", etc. is not judged on a daily basis, moving to a place like Fort Mac can be quite a culture shock.
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Old 10-08-2011, 09:20 AM   #89
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Just how many of those are not white?
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Old 10-08-2011, 09:23 AM   #90
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^ please dont be saying you cant go somewhere because there arent enough asians there
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Old 10-08-2011, 09:25 AM   #91
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Ok then how many east indians do you have up there?
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Old 10-08-2011, 11:31 AM   #92
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This whole moving to oil sands talk is taking away from the main issue of why there is a low supply of decent paying middle class jobs out there. The middle class is shrinking.

The system is fucked, which is why people are protesting.

How can you justify Exxon making $3 Billion dollars in profit a quarter? Oil companies manipulate the market by lobbying and then these execs also become the regulators of such oil companies. It's like hiring my best friend to regulate me to insure I don't break any rules. Most of the major conglomerates have excess of cash and produce record profits, yet they have a NET decrease in # of employees.
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Old 10-08-2011, 11:32 AM   #93
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I disagree with this. Why do you believe they are entitled it in any region?

Some jobs just don't pay well and some cities are more expensive.
It's not even stemming from a corrupt system. It's just nature. Not all things are equal, and sometimes, somewhere, being the top of the ladder isn't so far from the bottom. But sometimes, being at the bottom really sucks.

Living in Saskatchewan definitely cheaper than if you lived in Point Grey, North Shore, London, New York or Coal Harbour.
Why should a janitor be entitled to a wage that supports him living wherever he chooses? It's a simple reality that he is priced out of some regions. It's not an issue of corruption.

It's like being a house cat. In a person's house, they have cute skills that gets them food.
As an alley cat, it would have to rummage through garbage. It's fairly suitable to this.
In the savannah, it wouldn't last 10 days. It neither has the cunning, fortitude size or skills.
It's not fair, but that cat isn't entitled to a damn thing. Don't pretend that it is.

I have nothing against your argument as a whole, i find the ever growing disparity a sure tell of a broken system, but I just thought I should nip bad logic in the bud before it spirals out of control.
I think of region as a broader term, let me elaborate on my position.

I don't feel that a barista in Coal Harbor should be paid a wage that enables them to live in the immediate vicinity of where they work, but they should be able to earn a wage that allows them to live within an hours transit ride of their work in a less desirable neighbourhood. If members of the service industry, who our economy is fundamentally dependant on existing, simply all moved to less expensive regions then who would work as a barista serving educated professionals in the nicer neighbourhoods. Hondaracer, in his infinite ignorance, seems to think a person should move to Alberta or take whatever they can get and stop complaining.
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Old 10-08-2011, 11:45 AM   #94
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Old 10-08-2011, 12:59 PM   #95
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How can you justify Exxon making $3 Billion dollars in profit a quarter?
As a percentage of total sales $3B is far less than other companies, for instance the beloved Apple makes far more profit in percentages.

People suck at using context, they only look at numbers, especially large numbers.

Remember: it takes people spending unwisely for companies to make absurd profits. If you don't support these companies making that kind of money, don't buy from them. I don't buy overpriced Apple products that line Apple's pockets with cash, like you can choose to take the electric bus rather than buy gas and oil products.
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Old 10-08-2011, 01:25 PM   #96
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Return to what?

A low paying dead end job, because being a mindless bitch doesn't exactly develop marketable skills. I wouldn't hire someone who spent two years in the oil sands because they're greedy and were willing to do anything for a high short term income, someone who spent a few years developing skills would be a much better candidate for any position at any level.

In reality, this movement isn't about people expecting to make a high income at a entry level position, it's about the pay differential between rich and poor. Nothing should make the CEO of a company entitled to 475 times the average income of the employees of the same company, a person should simply be entitled to a liveable wage at all income levels and in any region.
This comment is in reference to what you said about the movement itself, but I think lots of people make comparisons to CEO salaries, but not as often about athletes who make millions themselves. If you are OK with athletes making tons of $, what difference is it if its a CEO? They both have "talents", except one is in his ability to run a company.

CEOs make crucial decisions that can affect the profitability of companies in the millions, can the average worker do this? I wouldn't bet on it. Good CEOs are constantly head hunted by other firms (which partly explains why you need to give them incentives to stay). They also tend to have professional degrees (at the minimum an undergrad, lots have MBAs and some have an LLB as well) and work extremely long hours compared to the average worker. Essentially, work becomes life. Is the average worker willing to do this? At the end of the day, the CEO is still an employee. What about people that actually own the companies and make much much more? If a CEO made 20 million a year (some make much more in stock options, some make as little as a few hundred thousand), and there was a cap, it still does not mean the $ goes to the workers, it just sits in the company coffers or goes to investors in the form of dividends.
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Old 10-08-2011, 02:11 PM   #97
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BTW, today on global news they said the lower mainlands unemployment rate is only 3.5%

and maybe if that chick above had taken a degree where it would have been worthwhile to take out loans etc. to get through school she wouldn't be in that predicament, bitching about having to drop out of an arts degree..

while travelling i met a girl from Virginia who was on her way to law school, she was in her 4th overall year of studies out of 6-7 potential years she would be doing, at this point in her 4th year she was $65,000 into her student loans, HOWEVER, speaking with financial planners and government staff she learned that if she was to take her law school training into the public sector, virtually all of her student loan would be void as a public servant, her good planning and long-term outlook will most likely land her a good paying career with smart choices and planning.. not something the majority of people in school seem to choose to do..

I love seeing this stupid stories on the news lately about people with "families" moving back east because of housing prices, cost of living, etc. the first thing that comes to my mind is, Maybe you should have tried a little harder?

or.. maybe you couldnt afford to have a child at this point in your life?..

are normal hard-working people suppose to have sympathy for these stories of mass-exodus from the west coast due to cost of living between a family of 2 barista's trying to raise a child?

EDIT* Also like Penner2k has pointed out in a thread right here in VanOT, if your bitching about cost of living or cant get a job that gets you anywhere, go work in Alberta in the oil industry, saving up 80k over a couple years of work is more than enough to put down for a home, or even an investment property to further your finances, but of course, and especially here on RS, people rather complain then get their hands dirty.
13 FUCKING PERCENT UNEMPLOYMENT. YOU ARE DUMB

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Old 10-08-2011, 02:19 PM   #98
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As a percentage of total sales $3B is far less than other companies, for instance the beloved Apple makes far more profit in percentages.

People suck at using context, they only look at numbers, especially large numbers.

Remember: it takes people spending unwisely for companies to make absurd profits. If you don't support these companies making that kind of money, don't buy from them. I don't buy overpriced Apple products that line Apple's pockets with cash, like you can choose to take the electric bus rather than buy gas and oil products.
Fuck dude, talk about context....

You can't compare the profit Apple makes to Exxon. For most, paying for gas is a necessity and buying a fucking iPad is not.

Last time I check there were not ample options for "electric" buses.
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Old 10-08-2011, 03:40 PM   #99
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To all the people in here ragging on going to Alberta tarsands: what's wrong with being a labourer? Or a tradesperson? How is that considered 'mindless' when inputting numbers into a spreadsheet isn't? How is the outlook for family life more bleak for them?

It's easy for me to see the people in here who think they are better than others based on their job choices.

Next thing is: Just because you have 2 masters degrees in comp sci and something else doesn't mean you are entitled to a high paying job, or even a job for that matter. If you want to make money, you find what need there is, and then fill it. If there are 100 million people with compsci degrees now, then wouldn't that be as completely useless as people with a religions degree?

You may absolutely hate your job, but you fill a niche, and make good money by doing it. If you want to exert your 'freedom', you can -- you can rack up $100k in debt learning things that are fun to you, but not necessarily useful to ANYONE else.
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Old 10-08-2011, 04:16 PM   #100
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Sometimes life sucks. I got fired from my career of 8 years in 2009, and no one was hiring my position to a level that I felt I deserved. So I decided to start my own company. I made less money that year, at age 25, than a 14 year old kid selling fries part time after school. srs. 2010 was a little better. 2011 Im making about 4 times as much as I did at my old job. It fucking sucked getting here, took 2 years and a massive amount of debt, and this year all I do is work, but the success is fantastic. I didnt have a good job, so I made one. Now I employ people as well, so not only have I created a good job for myself, but Ive created a few good jobs for other people as well.

The difference between me and these whiners? When times get tough and their job sucks they go stand around holding signs about it. When times got tough for me, I had ambition and work ethic and prospered.
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