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Vancouver Off-Topic / Current Events The off-topic forum for Vancouver, funnies, non-auto centered discussions, WORK SAFE. While the rules are more relaxed here, there are still rules. Please refer to sticky thread in this forum.

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Old 08-09-2014, 01:25 AM   #126
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Following my accident less than two years ago, my personal expenses to date are $12,659 for treatments, prescriptions, etc and counting. Yes ICBC covers all that but that's after negotiating, bureaucracy, court, etc.
Do you pay into any sort of MSP? or are you just not going through your MSP for costs because you weren't deemed at fault?

I broke both my hands last year, among a few other hurt parts of my body, the breaks were severe as 2 of my metacarpals were pointing out of my left hand. I needed two surgeries and my left hand is still fucked up slightly. Went to physio for 7 odd months, and rehabilitation since my left hand was completely immobilized for almost 2 months.

Excluding my missed wages for not being able to go to work for over a month, my total expenses incurred was like a grand total of maybe $300. Granted without my MSP from work, that would be notably higher.

I also do still need to go in for further X-rays, and possibly another surgery to correct what's still a little messed up in my hand.

My point is accidents, even really bad ones don't cost that much in terms of immediate treatment, sure if you don't have MSP physio can be expensive, but that's the risk you run when you chose not to pay into some program. Kinda your own undoing...

Now if you are left with life altering injuries, or disabilities, now we are talking serious life long expenses.

I really think everyone should just be praying for the best for Ovey, instead of looking at this like shes going to be wheel chair bound for life. Have some optimism, she is going to wake up, and be fine...
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Old 08-09-2014, 01:54 AM   #127
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Meet this girl once a long long time ago. Very energetic and lively. I wish you a speedy recover.


So my question is, why was she at that location at that time and alone? Doesn't sound like what a typical girl would do. The Sherlock in me thinks there's a lot more to this.
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Old 08-09-2014, 02:51 AM   #128
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Meet this girl once a long long time ago. Very energetic and lively. I wish you a speedy recover.


So my question is, why was she at that location at that time and alone? Doesn't sound like what a typical girl would do. The Sherlock in me thinks there's a lot more to this.
No one knows unless either her or the people she was with at that hour tells us which they probably would not though an explanation might have to be given if this case goes to court.

Ovey is very social and gets invited to lots of events. It could be a late night event with an after party with friends that took her that late. Since she was into Start ups, it could be working hard expanding the business and meeting with others to complete certain milestones. It could that she went on a date and it was such a great experience that it was extended way past midnight since they connected so well. We really don't know what she was doing at that hour. Things could range from the obvious that young adults do to work responsibilities to living a double life.
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Old 08-09-2014, 09:08 AM   #129
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Old 08-09-2014, 10:27 AM   #130
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Do you pay into any sort of MSP? or are you just not going through your MSP for costs because you weren't deemed at fault?

I broke both my hands last year, among a few other hurt parts of my body, the breaks were severe as 2 of my metacarpals were pointing out of my left hand. I needed two surgeries and my left hand is still fucked up slightly. Went to physio for 7 odd months, and rehabilitation since my left hand was completely immobilized for almost 2 months.

Excluding my missed wages for not being able to go to work for over a month, my total expenses incurred was like a grand total of maybe $300. Granted without my MSP from work, that would be notably higher.

I also do still need to go in for further X-rays, and possibly another surgery to correct what's still a little messed up in my hand.

...
Let's make sure we are talking about the same things. MSP is the govt health care plan. We all have to pay a monthly premium of $70 to be part of it. Personally I think it's a tax grab but I digress. Some employers will cover the MSP monthly premium for you as part of a benefits package. MSP only covers basic doctor visits and hospital treatments. That's it.

MSP doesn't cover prescriptions, optometrists, annual check ups, .physio, chiro, dentists, crutches, wheelchairs, and a lot of other stuff you might need. If you have a benefits plan from work, or you pay for one, then it might cover some or all of these things.

If you are in a car accident and it's not your fault, you can claim back all those expenses that MSP didn't cover from icbc. (Even you were at fault, you can get icbc to pay but you are entitled to much less). Same if you are injured on the job. Then any medical expenses are passed on to work safe. Even your benefits plan at work won't cover your expenses if you indicate they are from an accident. They will make icbc pay.

So in your case I'm not sure who paid for your physio and rehab but I bet it definitely wasn't MSP.

I think it's important to clear up any misconceptions for people who don't understand why we fundraise for ovey because they think taxes already pay for everything she will need to help recover. They don't unfortunately.
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Old 08-09-2014, 11:11 AM   #131
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You are a welder, if you get injured at work and your employer paid into Worksafe BC. Worksafe BC will cover the cost you mentioned, so you can get back to work ASAP (their mandate, they will even bump you through over people on the wait list if they know they can get you back to work). If you fall off your own roof while retrieving a wayward frisbee, then you will have to pay for the rehab yourself.

It seems you don't really know how the healthcare system work and who are the actors involved or their roles.

Your experience is non sequitur in the victim's scenario, because most startup doesn't qualify for Worksafe. Even if they are covered, Worksafe doesn't cover being hit by a car when you are on the way home.

The thing is once you have been injured, you still need to pay basic things like phones, rent, etc etc.. it is not like if you are injured, you are off the hook to pay any outstanding bills. I think the victim's friends is trying to cover that aspect and other out of pocket expenses.



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Originally Posted by meme405 View Post
Do you pay into any sort of MSP? or are you just not going through your MSP for costs because you weren't deemed at fault?

I broke both my hands last year, among a few other hurt parts of my body, the breaks were severe as 2 of my metacarpals were pointing out of my left hand. I needed two surgeries and my left hand is still fucked up slightly. Went to physio for 7 odd months, and rehabilitation since my left hand was completely immobilized for almost 2 months.

Excluding my missed wages for not being able to go to work for over a month, my total expenses incurred was like a grand total of maybe $300. Granted without my MSP from work, that would be notably higher.

I also do still need to go in for further X-rays, and possibly another surgery to correct what's still a little messed up in my hand.

My point is accidents, even really bad ones don't cost that much in terms of immediate treatment, sure if you don't have MSP physio can be expensive, but that's the risk you run when you chose not to pay into some program. Kinda your own undoing...

Now if you are left with life altering injuries, or disabilities, now we are talking serious life long expenses.

I really think everyone should just be praying for the best for Ovey, instead of looking at this like shes going to be wheel chair bound for life. Have some optimism, she is going to wake up, and be fine...
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Old 08-09-2014, 02:21 PM   #132
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MSP is the basic BC government health plan that everyone has to buy into. If you are low income, it is at a reduced rate or even free. MSP only covers the basic doctor visits and treatments. This means that it might be the cheapest treatment versus the best (and often most expensive) treatment that money can buy in the US privately owned hospitals. We don't get to choose the best doctors in that field and is often put on a long waitlist for a specialist in that field.

Medical equipment rentals (wheelchairs, hospital beds, clutches) are covered by the red cross in the short term (e.g. less than 3 months) or the government long term rental system and there is often a waitlist and the equipment is old.

Prescriptions, physio, chiro, etc is covered by the insurance plan that you buy into either as a student (the student plan) or the various work plans. Since Ovey is in a startup and she is in her mid 20s, the plan she most likely bought into is the basic plan with a cap on prescriptions per year as well as limited other benefits with a % deductible that one pays out of pocket (ranges from 50% on the low end to 70% on student plans to 80% on most work plans).

Fundraising for Ovey serves many purposes. She might need very specialized treatment that can only be found in the US and need to pay out of pocket. There is long term rehabilitation assistance (e.g. someone to help around the home), basic necessities that she still has to pay while in the hospital (rent, phone, bc hydro, etc).

The fundraising also serves the purpose of building Ovey's character and her potential earnings in the future and concern for her from the community would play a vital part in getting a settlement from ICBC either directly or through the court system. The lawyers have to paint a picture of what Ovey is like before the accident and what her future would have been versus what her life is like after the accident and this alternate future. The deviation between the two future scenarios is the amount in monetary terms that Ovey's lawyer would have to argue for her.


2013 BCSC 1545 Payne v. Miles

The above link is a past court case from a car accident and is approximately the steps that have to take place and the categories where compensation is appropriate. Often these cases occur years after the accident after recovery and assessment by doctors when recovery has plateaued. People from friends, past employers, and doctors who provided medical testimony as well as other people the person interacted provided evidence to build the person's before and after image.

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Let's make sure we are talking about the same things. MSP is the govt health care plan. We all have to pay a monthly premium of $70 to be part of it. Personally I think it's a tax grab but I digress. Some employers will cover the MSP monthly premium for you as part of a benefits package. MSP only covers basic doctor visits and hospital treatments. That's it.

MSP doesn't cover prescriptions, optometrists, annual check ups, .physio, chiro, dentists, crutches, wheelchairs, and a lot of other stuff you might need. If you have a benefits plan from work, or you pay for one, then it might cover some or all of these things.

If you are in a car accident and it's not your fault, you can claim back all those expenses that MSP didn't cover from icbc. (Even you were at fault, you can get icbc to pay but you are entitled to much less). Same if you are injured on the job. Then any medical expenses are passed on to work safe. Even your benefits plan at work won't cover your expenses if you indicate they are from an accident. They will make icbc pay.

So in your case I'm not sure who paid for your physio and rehab but I bet it definitely wasn't MSP.

I think it's important to clear up any misconceptions for people who don't understand why we fundraise for ovey because they think taxes already pay for everything she will need to help recover. They don't unfortunately.
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Old 08-09-2014, 10:08 PM   #133
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You are a welder, if you get injured at work and your employer paid into Worksafe BC. Worksafe BC will cover the cost you mentioned, so you can get back to work ASAP (their mandate, they will even bump you through over people on the wait list if they know they can get you back to work). If you fall off your own roof while retrieving a wayward frisbee, then you will have to pay for the rehab yourself.

It seems you don't really know how the healthcare system work and who are the actors involved or their roles.

Your experience is non sequitur in the victim's scenario, because most startup doesn't qualify for Worksafe. Even if they are covered, Worksafe doesn't cover being hit by a car when you are on the way home.

The thing is once you have been injured, you still need to pay basic things like phones, rent, etc etc.. it is not like if you are injured, you are off the hook to pay any outstanding bills. I think the victim's friends is trying to cover that aspect and other out of pocket expenses.


Sorry MSP was wrong.

I meant something like Industrial Alliance:

Industrial Alliance, Insurance and Financial Services

The company and you split the costs and they in turn pay for a LARGE portion of your prescription, physio, glasses, they also pay dental and stuff.

Many people even those, who work for companie which don't provide this service seek out a company and pay it themselves because it is a way of protecting your ass should you be injured.

For the record, I was not injured in the workplace, I fell mountain biking at whistler.
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Old 08-09-2014, 10:17 PM   #134
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People have raised more money for potato salad.

Any time an injury is severe enough that you have to remain in hospital, there will be costs one way or another.
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Old 08-09-2014, 10:17 PM   #135
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Standalone disability plan to cover your lost wages AND an individual health & dental plan.

Not sure why you would link to the home page of an insurance company and expect people to know what you are referring to.
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Old 08-14-2014, 12:35 AM   #136
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UPDATE:
We have raised over $36,000 for Ovey - THANK YOU! We haven't been able to respond to every comment and message but know that we have read all of them - thank you for the encouragement and kind words you've sent to us. It has been a rough week and a half for us all but we are grateful for the support.

Ovey's condition has improved and she is now out of the medically induced coma, but she remains in ICU. We will continue to add news on Ovey's condition as we hear, and will be using this page for updates - please visit this page for news as it's been difficult for us to respond to each individual that contacts us.
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Old 08-15-2014, 03:19 PM   #137
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I've been critically injured in a vehicle accident over 10 years ago through no fault of my own before and ICBC was generous with the payout. It allowed me to buy a $25,000 car outright at the age of 18 and pay for all of my undergraduate and graduate schooling with no parental help or student loans. The money has evaporated now but it made the next 10 years of my life easier than it could have been.

I'd never be so naive to think that the payout is ever worth the trauma and suffering incurred through rehabilitation from a serious accident. There are years and experiences you won't be able to get back. That said, ICBC can be worked - I've dealt with them on a number of occasions and have always felt the settlements, while not necessarily equal to the suffering, are fair.

I know many here on RS have different experiences and opinions, but I don't doubt that if Ovey has good, solid legal counsel she will be able to translate her lost wages, costs, opportunities and hardships into a $ settlement that we would find to be balanced and adequate. I do not think donating money if you do not know her is *necessary* in the long run because I believe ICBC will eventually dole out to her plenty (regardless of whether the civic driver is found), but I do not question anyone's charitable choices. Maybe her family needs the money in the short term?

I've met Ovey once. Nice a pleasant girl and a very unfortunate incident to happen to such a bubbly and positive person. I sense a bit of latent jealousy from the responses here and from a number of others that have commented on this incident. No one set up a crowdfunding for me but that's probably because I didn't put the energy and effort into making a lot of friends and connections at the time that would warrant it. My only reservation that prevents me from donating is that I'm pretty sure ICBC will give her more than enough to cover her needs given my own experience, so I will hold off until I know more about how serious and long-term her injuries are, and how her quality of life going forward will be diminished.
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Old 08-15-2014, 04:28 PM   #138
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I've been critically injured in a vehicle accident over 10 years ago through no fault of my own before and ICBC was generous with the payout. It allowed me to buy a $25,000 car outright at the age of 18 and pay for all of my undergraduate and graduate schooling with no parental help or student loans. The money has evaporated now but it made the next 10 years of my life easier than it could have been.

I'd never be so naive to think that the payout is ever worth the trauma and suffering incurred through rehabilitation from a serious accident. There are years and experiences you won't be able to get back. That said, ICBC can be worked - I've dealt with them on a number of occasions and have always felt the settlements, while not necessarily equal to the suffering, are fair.

I know many here on RS have different experiences and opinions, but I don't doubt that if Ovey has good, solid legal counsel she will be able to translate her lost wages, costs, opportunities and hardships into a $ settlement that we would find to be balanced and adequate. I do not think donating money if you do not know her is *necessary* in the long run because I believe ICBC will eventually dole out to her plenty (regardless of whether the civic driver is found), but I do not question anyone's charitable choices. Maybe her family needs the money in the short term?

I've met Ovey once. Nice a pleasant girl and a very unfortunate incident to happen to such a bubbly and positive person. I sense a bit of latent jealousy from the responses here and from a number of others that have commented on this incident. No one set up a crowdfunding for me but that's probably because I didn't put the energy and effort into making a lot of friends and connections at the time that would warrant it. My only reservation that prevents me from donating is that I'm pretty sure ICBC will give her more than enough to cover her needs given my own experience, so I will hold off until I know more about how serious and long-term her injuries are, and how her quality of life going forward will be diminished.
Doubt they will offer her much in terms on lost wage. She is a president of a start up with really no profit or asset or revenue. So basically, ICBC won't or provide very little in terms of wage lost....... Maybe that's why the are raising funds for her. in case she can't run the company anymore and have no job to support herself in the future.
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Old 08-17-2014, 08:26 AM   #139
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Since it was a hit and run, the most ICBC can pay out is $200k -- and that's to account for a lot of stuff, including the "pain and suffering" damages, lost wages (past loss and future loss) and the cost of her future care too.

$200k isn't much if the injuries are long term and severe.

source: i is lawyer.
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Old 08-17-2014, 11:42 AM   #140
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Since it was a hit and run, the most ICBC can pay out is $200k -- and that's to account for a lot of stuff, including the "pain and suffering" damages, lost wages (past loss and future loss) and the cost of her future care too.

$200k isn't much if the injuries are long term and severe.

source: i is lawyer.
Plus 150K in Part 7 benefits and TTDs.

She also might qualify for UMP.
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Old 08-17-2014, 02:43 PM   #141
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Since it was a hit and run, the most ICBC can pay out is $200k -- and that's to account for a lot of stuff, including the "pain and suffering" damages, lost wages (past loss and future loss) and the cost of her future care too.

$200k isn't much if the injuries are long term and severe.

source: i is lawyer.
Let's hope they catch the person then, so it's not considered a hit and run.
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Old 08-17-2014, 09:57 PM   #142
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Let's hope they catch the person then, so it's not considered a hit and run.
It is easier said than done. 2 weeks has already passed which means that it is very likely that the car has been repaired. The police has to find the car, and prove that the owner of the car is the actual person in the car. It is a very difficult case to prove. A large amount of resources would have to be poured into finding the driver. Without critical leads that the police can follow, there isn't much they can do. The driver is unlikely to turn himself/herself in because the liability from this case would be in the 7 figures. Most likely, the person's insurance is not enough to cover it and the person would have to spend their life paying off this debt liability to Ovey.
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Old 10-08-2014, 03:49 PM   #143
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Any update on this? Has the driver been found? How is Ovey's recovery thus far?
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Old 10-08-2014, 03:59 PM   #144
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Any update on this? Has the driver been found? How is Ovey's recovery thus far?
Looks like she's doing much better!

https://twitter.com/oveyyeung

No update on driver.
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Old 10-08-2014, 09:16 PM   #145
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Good to see she's doing well. Hope the driver is found!
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Old 10-08-2014, 10:33 PM   #146
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Any update on this? Has the driver been found? How is Ovey's recovery thus far?
She left rehab earlier today and is in great spirits and looks/sounds like she'll make a full recovery. She even posted a photo of dinner she cooked tonight haha

Unfortunately, the driver is still at large
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