SkyTrain won't take bus transfers with new Compass Card system

[dinosaur]

Originally Posted by dbaz

I dont know what we'd ever do without you two on this forum...

I would respond, but I don't want to get banned from this thread

[Gridlock]

Originally Posted by buhdeh

seriously, there was no need for that. dbaz wasn't even being confrontational. but i guess people would rather write a big, angry wall of text full of insults for some thanks.

I'll be the one that determines what I find I have a need to do

I know dbaz. Was my post harsh? Sure. He had his fun, told me to go fuck myself or whatever, and I get a new cool quote for my sig.

'tis over.

But you seem to be happy to put your 2 cents in looking for some thanks. I'll even give ya one Happy?

[stewie]

Originally Posted by Gridlock

I'll be the one that determines what I find I have a need to do

I know dbaz. Was my post harsh? Sure. He had his fun, told me to go fuck myself or whatever, and I get a new cool quote for my sig.

'tis over.

But you seem to be happy to put your 2 cents in looking for some thanks. I'll even give ya one Happy?

if he gets one I want one!!! don't make me whine louder and harder!!!

[RecklessNS]

Revscene has amazed me the past couple of threads, only to realize that these off topic discussions are coming from past events. Honestly, No wonder a thread can't make it past the 3st page, cause shit gets serious at one point then it becomes unnecessary. I'm not calling anyone out, just a trend I've been noticing.

I log onto my computer in the morning only to go back to my kitchen to get some popcorn for all the stuff I read on here now.
ps.

Spoiler!

the 3st was a joke, suck it phaneuf.#notevenruslted

[Gridlock]

Originally Posted by RecklessNS

Revscene has amazed me the past couple of threads, only to realize that these off topic discussions are coming from past events. Honestly, No wonder a thread can't make it past the 3st page, cause shit gets serious at one point then it becomes unnecessary. I'm not calling anyone out, just a trend I've been noticing.

I log onto my computer in the morning only to go back to my kitchen to get some popcorn for all the stuff I read on here now.
ps.

Spoiler!

the 3st was a joke, suck it phaneuf.#notevenruslted

[StylinRed]

Seems like Translink is just listening to us drivers finally start gouging those who use the transportation services and give us drivers some slack

well now lets hope we drivers are given a break from more taxes to pay for bus/train services :/

[SoNaRWaVe]

if i recall my compass training class, delivered by CUBIC (the folks who made the system for translink), said that each gate can handle 30 people per minute. so a station with 4 gates is 120 people per minute. the numbers will be much lower than that initially when everyone is getting used to the system, but when everyone gets accustomed to it, that sounds like a decent flow of people.

each gate is also programmable for one way entry/exit only. so over time, if there is a huge number of people getting into the trains rather than out, or whatever the case is, the gates can be programmed to let more people in/out for better flow.

everyone here has valid points on the POTENTIAL problems. its all speculation at best. we won't know anything for certain until the system is tested (from the current 5,000 beta testers) or when the system is stress test when its is officially open to the public.

compass is to meant get rid of any current fare media. so obviously people will be pissed with whatever methods translink chooses to phase out the current fare media. you just can't please everyone, no matter what they do. they can only do what they think will best help them as a business and the public's interest.

[smoothie.]

Originally Posted by StylinRed

Seems like Translink is just listening to us drivers finally start gouging those who use the transportation services and give us drivers some slack

well now lets hope we drivers are given a break from more taxes to pay for bus/train services :/

I wish they were "gouging"

Pretty sure this is them trying to be less in the red. They're already killing employee discount programs too and Ill be surprised if they're not in the hole when numbers come out after all this
Posted via RS Mobile

[JesseBlue]

from reading most of the comments here, it seems like most are not even transit users...

from the question about how the reader knows youre entering or exiting, there are two readers, one on the outside when you enter and one on the inside when you are exiting...

from the bus perspective, it might be a little different as people can exit in front of the bus...if they (translink) explains enough that only the rear scanner would "refund" based on the distance, then it should work...

inconvenient? sure...thats part of life....we already live in a nice place and i would consider this a first world problem...

[willystyle]

This is so minor that it shouldn't even be considered a problem.

Just use the Compass Card then.

[Ikkaku]

I honestly wonder how the transition was for other major cities, when they implemented the card system.

I think the simplified way the system works in HK, at least for the busses, is that they count how many stops you are away from the busses' final destination/station, and charge based on that (Plus extra fees if you cross a tunnel or bridge I think). Transfers and such are a bit too complex for me to understand, however.

The MTR uses the basic entry gate and exit gate to calculate the distance traveled. If you don't tap the gate to exit, it will charge you the full price.

I look forward to seeing if it will eventually be implemented into our daily lives like how it is with the octopus card, being able to make small purchases and all. Also, being able to refill your card in convenient locations is a bonus!

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by Traum

The problem here is, all of the different Translink mediums (buses, Skytrains / Canada Line, Seabus) has always worked as a single integrated system for transit users. You pay the right amount once, and you can use all the different modes of transportation however you want within the valid duration of your ticket. There are discounts available depending on how you pay your fare, but it is still a single integrated payment and ridership system. This has been the norm for as long as I can remember (easily 25+ years). And now Translink is saying "screw you" to all the cash paying riders.

How so? Because the machines at SkyTrain stations can't read paper transfers? So what should they have done, spend a shitload of extra money to add that capability for something that's going to be phased out eventually anyway?

People are not necessarily fuming because they have to pay extra to take the Skytrain; they are fuming because of stupidity and poor planning that Translink has once again displayed.

Have they? Really? Or have their plans been forced onto the fast track by constant public, media, and political pressure to implement them before the system is ready for a PROPER one-time roll-out?

The system isn't "fractured". The PAYMENT system is going through a transition. This is not odd, surprising, or unheard-of. This too shall pass, and all will be right with the world again (at least until the next big panic). Get over it.

[Soundy]

Originally Posted by MindBomber

The employee pass program (EEP) and the U-Pass program operated on significantly different standards.

In the case of U-Pass programs, student unions arrange contracts with Translink that ensure a minimum of 95% of a student body will participate in the program. Nine student unions currently participate to a total of 160,000 issued U-Passes.

While in the case of EEP programs, workplaces with over 25 employees were able to register to Translink to participate in the program. 250 employers had been participating to a total of 25,000 passes issued.

The U-Pass program is largely profitable and otherwise effective, despite the deep discount.

The EEP program lost a significant amount of money and was not especially effective.

Therefore, suggesting the cancellation of EEP may be a sign the cancellation of U-Pass is imminent is pure folly.

The beauty of the Compass-type system is that both these things can be implemented and managed a lot easier and cheaper: no need to have separate photo passes, cards, etc. for different programs - people who join the plan simply have the relevant discounts applied to their registered Compass card, and it's all automatic and transparent.

[Eff-1]

Well I think all of us can agree on one thing:

For a variety of reasons, once this system launches it's going to be a complete and utter gong show for the first few months.

[Traum]

Originally Posted by Soundy

How so? Because the machines at SkyTrain stations can't read paper transfers? So what should they have done, spend a shitload of extra money to add that capability for something that's going to be phased out eventually anyway?

There are many different ways to handle the problem that has developed now, so more elegant than others. Off the top of my head, a viable solution is to issue/use on the buses the equivalent of what the 1-time use compass card that are given out when people pay cash at the Skytrain station. This way, there is only 1 system to deal with. Another possible solution (and probably a cheaper one too) is to install a single bus transfer converter machine of some sort that will issue the same single-use campss card that gets dispensed at the Skytrain station. If cash-paying riders are as sparse as Translink claims, a single machine at each Skytrain station should be more than enough. And then you retain the continuity with the single fare system that we currently have, instead of leaving people out cold.

Yes, it will cost a bit of extra money. But it won't be the "shxtload of extra funds" that you claim they'll need.

The system isn't "fractured". The PAYMENT system is going through a transition. This is not odd, surprising, or unheard-of. This too shall pass, and all will be right with the world again (at least until the next big panic). Get over it.

Years ago when I visited Hong Kong, I think the subway system there was undergoing a similar transition from magnetic fare cards to their current Octopus smart card system. For at least a good long while, both systems were retained. I don't remember the details anymore, but I'm pretty sure that for a time, the single use magnetic fare cards were used along side of the Octopus smart cards. That was a good transition because no passengers were left out in the cold. The proposed plan that Translink has for us is flawed, because cash-paying riders are getting screwed.

[SoNaRWaVe]

there will be one time use compass fares if i am not mistaken. but i believe that it will be cheaper to buy the actual compass card and to load money on it.

i was also told that the actual card, actually costs $6. how they will incorporate that into the costs of fares/cards, i do not know.

i don't think cash paying fare riders are getting screwed, it is just more beneficial for them to get the compass card.

[Not really racist!]

Card costing $6.. probably have something like you can go into the negatives once, so even if you have not enough money on the card you can still travel that one way distance

I'm more curious about reloading the card and how convenient it'll be...

[GLOW]

Originally Posted by Gridlock

I'd flex my real penis over this site too if it was socially acceptable.

time for you to steal frip's avatar

[SoNaRWaVe]

Originally Posted by Not really racist!

Card costing $6.. probably have something like you can go into the negatives once, so even if you have not enough money on the card you can still travel that one way distance

I'm more curious about reloading the card and how convenient it'll be...

from what i understand, it should be fairly easy and convenient to reload. i am not sure if this is implemented with roll out, but i've been told that you can do auto reloads. i think the new machines that they have installed also allows you to reload.

stadium skytrain station is where the main compass office will be to help people out and possibly also purchase in that location.

EDIT: here we go. http://www.straight.com/blogra/41034...rld-class-city

[DragonChi]

Originally Posted by Soundy

The beauty of the Compass-type system is that both these things can be implemented and managed a lot easier and cheaper: no need to have separate photo passes, cards, etc. for different programs - people who join the plan simply have the relevant discounts applied to their registered Compass card, and it's all automatic and transparent.

The point of the photos on upasses was that it would impede the sale of a upass to someone not eligible.

[DragonChi]

Originally Posted by Soundy

How so? Because the machines at SkyTrain stations can't read paper transfers? So what should they have done, spend a shitload of extra money to add that capability for something that's going to be phased out eventually anyway?

They could rig up a card reader from a bus to one of the gates. I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be hard to do.

[bing]

lol @ people bitching about having to carry one more card.

[Ikkaku]

For Octo card, they too charge a $50 hkd refundable deposit

"Our basic Octopus product. It comes with a refundable HK$50 deposit which covers HK$30 card cost and ensures uninterrupted Octopus service in case of negative value. Child, Adult and Elder cards are available."
Standard Octopus - Octopus Hong Kong

The people who are comparing this system to HK should not be complaining.

[Gridlock]

Originally Posted by Ikkaku

For Octo card, they too charge a $50 hkd refundable deposit

"Our basic Octopus product. It comes with a refundable HK$50 deposit which covers HK$30 card cost and ensures uninterrupted Octopus service in case of negative value. Child, Adult and Elder cards are available."
Standard Octopus - Octopus Hong Kong

The people who are comparing this system to HK should not be complaining.

Oh yes, won't you think of the homeless then.

[DragonChi]

Originally Posted by SoNaRWaVe

from what i understand, it should be fairly easy and convenient to reload. i am not sure if this is implemented with roll out, but i've been told that you can do auto reloads. i think the new machines that they have installed also allows you to reload.

stadium skytrain station is where the main compass office will be to help people out and possibly also purchase in that location.

EDIT: here we go. A long list of public transit gripes in a so-called world-class city | Georgia Straight

Wow, reading that article got me to jump the fence on this issue. Sounds pretty Biased. But the taking away Free rides for families on Sundays?! That's some money grabbing bullshit right there.

WTF, implementing compass to stop fare evaders? what a bullshit reason. I'm sure fare evaders will still find a way to get past the gates. it's not that hard to jump the gates.

Where the hell is this 15 mil per year to run this going to?!

I love public transit, I've ridden public transit in eight different cities, Vancouver ranks somewhere in the middle.

I'm hoping still, in the long run this compass thing will help with their decision making.