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Old 09-14-2014, 10:37 PM   #651
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Memo to Iker and Fassbender: this is how negotiations work.

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Old 09-14-2014, 11:57 PM   #652
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What the teachers need to understand is that if they get all their demands, they'll be fucking over the kids in the future with the extra debt it creates.
What extra debt? It's up to the government how the education system is to be funded. They are spinning the story by saying that it'll cost each taxpayer $200 extra per year. We all belong to different tax brackets. There are many options to make it fair and to make it work.

The government could increase corporate taxes (which are the lowest in Canada). If they go up by a mere 1%, there will be enough to fund these improvements with extra to spare. This is to return to the education system what shouldn't have been taken away in the first place.

If you give students a shitty education in shitty conditions, you may be inhibiting the potential income that these kids in the future could earn with higher paying jobs. Even with the government spin of $200 extra annually, I doubt that would be throwing all these kids deep into debt when they're adults.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:04 AM   #653
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Take the Child Tax Credit away and increase income tax for people with kids in school and put that money towards the education system.

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Old 09-15-2014, 12:31 AM   #654
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ok so, 2 weeks gone, judging by how little to no progress they have made, it's not likely they're gonna solve the problem in next 2 weeks.
They're gonna enter October!

Seems like one of the party has to lose.
There's no win-win situation.

This is getting entertaining to be honest, I'm gonna watch this shit live
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Old 09-15-2014, 06:50 AM   #655
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^

I'd agree, I never thought when it started it would last this long I figured they would have called back the legislature early and legislated them back already. I did not believe they would come to a resolution on there own without legislation and it looks like it's headed that way, looks like it will end second week of October baring any miracles before then.
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Old 09-15-2014, 09:05 AM   #656
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Stopped following this closely, but I'm just wondering why I don't see teachers on the corner while I drive to work in the morning anymore?

They used to be there everyday at the beginning of summer.
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Old 09-15-2014, 09:31 AM   #657
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they're at the schools i drive by in east van. even more so i think.
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Old 09-15-2014, 09:59 AM   #658
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Stopped following this closely, but I'm just wondering why I don't see teachers on the corner while I drive to work in the morning anymore?

They used to be there everyday at the beginning of summer.
Once the regular school year was over teachers ain't hanging around when it's 30 deg out to picket.

Wouldn't doubt it's the same now or they do it in shifts. The highschool right next to my house rarely has more than 6-8 teachers there when there's probably 40+ who work there.
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Old 09-15-2014, 10:29 AM   #659
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ok so, 2 weeks gone, judging by how little to no progress they have made, it's not likely they're gonna solve the problem in next 2 weeks.
They're gonna enter October!

Seems like one of the party has to lose.
There's no win-win situation.

This is getting entertaining to be honest, I'm gonna watch this shit live
Is this going off on all your experience of negotiating? lol I wait for the day that you say something of value.
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Old 09-15-2014, 11:04 AM   #660
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I talked to a few teachers and they have no idea what is going on.
The BCTF doesn't tell them anything.

I am really curious to know what the BCTF wants and what the government is willing to give, but the teachers themselves have no idea.

If I were a teacher, I would get a new BCTF.
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Old 09-15-2014, 11:06 AM   #661
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Once the regular school year was over teachers ain't hanging around when it's 30 deg out to picket.

Wouldn't doubt it's the same now or they do it in shifts. The highschool right next to my house rarely has more than 6-8 teachers there when there's probably 40+ who work there.
Well I know why they weren't there in the summer, but its september now, they should be back on the line now... The two schools I drive by on my way to work have nobody at them.

Also I really don't understand this "shift" Pickiting. When the Union responsible for the mine workers at the job site I was at conducted a full scale strike. All 250 employees scheduled to work would come and walk the line at their regular hours, that meant that night shift employees were there walking the line from 7PM, until 5am. They were there on weekends and holidays as well just like they would have been has they been working.

This strike just seems so fucking lazy. You want us to take you seriously, show some fucking solidarity and walk the walk.

Right now if I was the government I wouldn't be taking the union seriously either, I mean it looks like half the teachers would leave the union if they could just get back to work...

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Old 09-15-2014, 11:16 AM   #662
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If I were a teacher, I would get a new BCTF.
is that even an option or possible?
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Old 09-15-2014, 11:24 AM   #663
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When I go to work in the morning, I pass through Vancouver, Burnaby, and New Westminster. Every school I pass by always has staff picketing outside. Every time I pass, I honk to give them my support.

For those who are not familiar with the extent to which the cost cutting measures are hurting our public education system, please take a look at this. I recently came across the following Twitter image from a Port Coquitlam principle:



The screen shot is an e-mail a Port Coquitlam principal has sent to the parents of his school explaining how resources have dwindled in the 12 years he has served at his school. His budget for learning resources (books, desks, and the like) has dropped from $181,000 (2002) to $23,000 (2014), an 88% drop over 12 years. The principal tells parents that teachers are working harder than ever to deliver the same quality of education their students rightfully deserve.

To those of you who run a business, how do you expect your business to operate with a 88% reduction in operating budget? To those of you who run your own household budgets, how do you provide for your family and raise your children if you face an 88% less money coming in?

If you think the BC government is doing the right thing today by refusing to cough up more education funding (in the name of "we can't afford it without raising taxes"), please continue to support them.
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Old 09-15-2014, 11:52 AM   #664
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^ prove that these are "facts"

Anyone (especially those with a vested interest in changing hearts and minds) can write an email.

Don't be so easily fooled
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Old 09-15-2014, 11:54 AM   #665
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I talked to a few teachers and they have no idea what is going on.
The BCTF doesn't tell them anything.

I am really curious to know what the BCTF wants and what the government is willing to give, but the teachers themselves have no idea.

If I were a teacher, I would get a new BCTF.
Bctf does a crap job representing And supporting their members

Not saying the government is any better, but if I were a member of the bctf, I'd look for a new profession
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:02 PM   #666
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was that a reasonable operating budget for the school in 2002? too much or too little?
was it adjusted to meet actual operating costs?
and what were their actual costs?
just asking as I have no idea.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:13 PM   #667
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^ prove that these are "facts"

Anyone (especially those with a vested interest in changing hearts and minds) can write an email.

Don't be so easily fooled
You can certainly choose to be skeptical. As a matter of fact, you can continue to believe anything you want. But if you think school's operating budgets have not been continually cut back over the past decade or so under the BC Liberals' rule, you are simply refusing to accept the truth.

Support staff getting cut. School libraries opening only every other day (or less) instead of remaining open every single day. Class sizes getting larger. More special needs students getting dumped into regular classes. I don't need to tell you whether they are true facts or fabricated lies. You are free to believe whatever you want to believe.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:26 PM   #668
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More special needs students getting dumped into regular classes.
We should also talk about how much higher the percentage of "special needs" students there are.

Now with ADHD, and all these other supposed forms of learning disabilities and impediments. It seems that half our fucking kids are retarded according to teachers.

The best is "Anxiety disorder" - im pretty sure that can just be renamed to "teenager"
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:29 PM   #669
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You can certainly choose to be skeptical. As a matter of fact, you can continue to believe anything you want. But if you think school's operating budgets have not been continually cut back over the past decade or so under the BC Liberals' rule, you are simply refusing to accept the truth.

Support staff getting cut. School libraries opening only every other day (or less) instead of remaining open every single day. Class sizes getting larger. More special needs students getting dumped into regular classes. I don't need to tell you whether they are true facts or fabricated lies. You are free to believe whatever you want to believe.
I don't doubt some of those are in fact true, but you are merely providing rhetoric. Without proof, u are no better than someone that fabricates stories.

I don't like special needs kids not getting the help they need, nor that kids do not have everything they need to most effectively learn, but without independent findings, we're just throwing shit at one another.

Again, I do not support either side, but I will not blindly believe something just bc it is put infront of me, as you clearly are.

Informed decisions are the most valuable decisions.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:33 PM   #670
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You can certainly choose to be skeptical. As a matter of fact, you can continue to believe anything you want. But if you think school's operating budgets have not been continually cut back over the past decade or so under the BC Liberals' rule, you are simply refusing to accept the truth.

Support staff getting cut. School libraries opening only every other day (or less) instead of remaining open every single day. Class sizes getting larger. More special needs students getting dumped into regular classes. I don't need to tell you whether they are true facts or fabricated lies. You are free to believe whatever you want to believe.
He's not saying that the budgets have not been cut but we should treat all this public media non-sense as propaganda. You dropped numbers decreasing the budgets from $100,000's of thousands of dollars and he's saying let's look at real statistics rather than media props sent out to the public to gain support.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:36 PM   #671
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I don't doubt some of those are in fact true, but you are merely providing rhetoric. Without proof, u are no better than someone that fabricates stories.

I don't like special needs kids not getting the help they need, nor that kids do not have everything they need to most effectively learn, but without independent findings, we're just throwing shit at one another.

Again, I do not support either side, but I will not blindly believe something just bc it is put infront of me, as you clearly are.

Informed decisions are the most valuable decisions.
In that case, I strongly recommend you to actually sit down and talk to a school administrator or front line teacher to see what kind of impacts the reduced education budget has done to the schools. I have done that myself; I have seen the impact the reduced budgets have caused, and I have very little reason to question the validity of those claims.
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:38 PM   #672
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He's not saying that the budgets have not been cut but we should treat all this public media non-sense as propaganda. You dropped numbers decreasing the budgets from $100,000's of thousands of dollars and he's saying let's look at real statistics rather than media props sent out to the public to gain support.
Don't be absurd, it's only the Government that releases partial or one sided biased statistics and numbers to further there agenda.

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Old 09-15-2014, 12:42 PM   #673
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Who hands out those school budgets? the school district? If its the district, then that joke of budget for the school in Poco doesn't surprise me as its SD43. They aren't exactly the best when it comes with handling money.

SD43 audit released, but not the full version - News - Coquitlam Now
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Old 09-15-2014, 12:42 PM   #674
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In that case, I strongly recommend you to actually sit down and talk to a school administrator or front line teacher to see what kind of impacts the reduced education budget has done to the schools. I have done that myself; I have seen the impact the reduced budgets have caused, and I have very little reason to question the validity of those claims.
again you would be talking to someone who has a vested interest in the outcome of these negotiations. Looking at this from a factual and statistical standpoint is the only way to make sense of the situation.

If I was in negotiations with my employer (if I wasn't my own employer), I would never tell them "Oh no, my department has absolutely everything they need to be successful, extra money won't make us any better at all".
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Old 09-15-2014, 01:01 PM   #675
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Who hands out those school budgets? the school district? If its the district, then that joke of budget for the school in Poco doesn't surprise me as its SD43. They aren't exactly the best when it comes with handling money.

SD43 audit released, but not the full version - News - Coquitlam Now
The government gives districts money, and it's up to the districts to balance their budgets using the money coming from the government.
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