George Floyd protests in America

[westopher]

It should be pretty easy to figure out if there was any intention behind it. If he’s the only person who’s garage it was in I’d say it’s pretty glaring there was a message behind it. That’s information thats easy to find and easy to share.

[welfare]

Originally Posted by westopher

It should be pretty easy to figure out if there was any intention behind it.

There wasn't.
Photos from his stall back in 2019 showed the exact same pull cord. Before he ever set foot in there. And before anyone could have possibly known he'd occupy it in the future.

[ImportPsycho]

I wonder why NASCAR waited until now to release the photo....

[Manic!]

Originally Posted by welfare

There wasn't.
Photos from his stall back in 2019 showed the exact same pull cord. Before he ever set foot in there. And before anyone could have possibly known he'd occupy it in the future.

Why would you use a noose as a pull cord? When you pull it, it would tighten around your hand.

Some people hang garlic to repel vampires. I guess someone thought a noose would do the same for blacks.

[Jmac]

Originally Posted by ImportPsycho

I wonder why NASCAR waited until now to release the photo....

Well, there was an active investigation which I would guess they didn't want to interfere with.

Then the investigation concluded that no hate crime took place. If they released the photo at that point, especially given the current climate towards law enforcement, I'm sure many people wouldn't have been happy with the FBI and likely would've accused them of a coverup/white supremacy.

Then many people, including some in the media, started accusing Bubba Wallace and his team of making it up or faking it, some comparing him to Jussie Smollett, who infamously staged a hate crime to try to get a better contract.

At that point, I feel NASCAR probably felt it would be prudent to release the photo to protect Bubba Wallace and his team from those accusations.

[Jmac]

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/ne...243779512.html

Three members of a North Carolina police department have been fired after a department audit of a video recording captured one of the officers saying a civil war was necessary to wipe Black people off the map and that he was ready.

The Wilmington Police Department took the action on Tuesday against Cpl. Jessie Moore, and officers Kevin Piner and Brian Gilmore. Each was accused of violating standards of conduct, criticism and use of inappropriate jokes and slurs. After conferring with the city council, Wilmington City Manager Sterling Cheatham cleared Police Chief Donny Williams to release the details.

“When I first learned of these conversations, I was shocked, saddened and disgusted,” Williams said at a news conference on Wednesday. “There is no place for this behavior in our agency or our city and it will not be tolerated.”

According to documents released by the police department, a sergeant was conducting a video audit as part of a monthly inspection and was reviewing footage from Piner’s car that had been classified as “accidental activation.” After the sergeant listened to the conversation and determined comments made by Piner and Moore were “extremely racist,” she contacted the department administrator for the camera system.

At the 46-minute mark of the video, Piner and Gilmore began talking from their respective cars, at which time Piner criticized the department, saying its only concern was “kneeling down with the black folks.” About 30 minutes later, Piner received a phone call from Moore, according to the investigation, a segment in which Moore referred to a Black female as a “negro.” He also referred to the woman by using a racial slur. He repeated the use of the slur in describing a Black magistrate, and Moore used a gay slur to describe the magistrate as well.

Later, according to the investigation, Piner told Moore that he feels a civil war is coming and that he is ready. Piner said he was going to buy a new assault rifle, and soon “we are just going to go out and start slaughtering them (expletive)” Blacks. “I can’t wait. God, I can’t wait.” Moore responded that he wouldn’t do that.

Piner then told Moore that he felt a civil war was needed to “wipe them off the (expletive) map. That’ll put them back about four or five generations.” Moore told Piner he was “crazy,” and the recording stopped a short time later.

According to police, the officers admitted it was their voices on the video and didn’t deny any of the content. While the officers denied that they were racists, they blamed their comments on the stress on law enforcement in light of the protests over the death of George Floyd. Floyd, a Black man, died last month after a Minneapolis police officer put his knee on Floyd’s neck for several minutes.

In addition to being fired, cases involving the Wilmington officers will be reviewed by the district attorney’s office to determine if they committed any crimes or showed bias toward criminal defendants. Williams said he will recommend the three officers not be rehired by notifying the N.C. Criminal Justice Training and Standards Commission about their behavior.

Later, according to the investigation, Piner told Moore that he feels a civil war is coming and that he is ready. Piner said he was going to buy a new assault rifle, and soon “we are just going to go out and start slaughtering them (expletive)” Blacks. “I can’t wait. God, I can’t wait.” Moore responded that he wouldn’t do that.

Piner then told Moore that he felt a civil war was needed to “wipe them off the (expletive) map. That’ll put them back about four or five generations.” Moore told Piner he was “crazy,” and the recording stopped a short time later.

According to police, the officers admitted it was their voices on the video and didn’t deny any of the content. While the officers denied that they were racists, they blamed their comments on the stress on law enforcement in light of the protests over the death of George Floyd.

I'm curious as to why Gilmore got fired as nothing is detailed about anything he did (didn't report it?)

[westopher]

Originally Posted by welfare

There wasn't.
Photos from his stall back in 2019 showed the exact same pull cord. Before he ever set foot in there. And before anyone could have possibly known he'd occupy it in the future.

Was there a noose in any single other garage? If not, it’s not like it’s impossible that some guy was like “put bubba in that garage” and that would show some pretty obvious intent, whether it’s meant to be a shitty joke or a threat I don’t know. If there are the same rope in any other garages I’d say yes it’s pretty obvious there was likely no intent behind it. It’s not like something simply existing before it was used for something it wasn’t meant to be used for at the time of fabrication means there’s no possible way it was used for something.

[hud 91gt]

JMac article above is fricken insane. Amazing there is actually people out there like that.


I was pretty shocked to hear the FBIs investigation results and didn’t think it made any sense. But the more I think about it... Getting “murdered” or “slaughtered” are terms used to described getting your butt kicked in any sport events. Could a noose be a practicle joke to describe the above. The whole situation it weird, especially since no one else has spoken out about it’s previous presence.

[punkwax]

Originally Posted by westopher

Was there a noose in any single other garage? If not, it’s not like it’s impossible that some guy was like “put bubba in that garage” and that would show some pretty obvious intent, whether it’s meant to be a shitty joke or a threat I don’t know. If there are the same rope in any other garages I’d say yes it’s pretty obvious there was likely no intent behind it. It’s not like something simply existing before it was used for something it wasn’t meant to be used for at the time of fabrication means there’s no possible way it was used for something.

Originally Posted by StylinRed

So the noose was a garage door handle that's been there for a year

“The investigation also revealed evidence, including authentic video confirmed by Nascar, that the noose found in garage number 4 was in that garage as early as October 2019.

"Although the noose is now known to have been in garage number 4 in 2019, nobody could have known Mr Wallace would be assigned to garage number 4 last week."

https://www.bbc.com/sport/motorsport/53159686

Seems you missed this.

[westopher]

I didn’t miss it. I’m asking a question. Was there any nooses in any other garages, and did the people assigning the garages know that the noose was in that one single garage, if not? There’s nothing that clarifies any of those things in the article.
Somebody assigns teams to garages, hence the word “assigned,” so it’s possible that person(s) has intent behind assigning wallace to that garage. I’m not saying that’s the case, but it’s pretty odd that the one black guy that’s speaking out against racism in nascar ends up in the one garage (if that’s the case) that has a symbol of the murder of blacks throughout US’ history.

[punkwax]

Pretty sure it was the only one or it would’ve been reported there were others I would imagine.

I don’t quite understand the “nobody could have known Mr Wallace would be assigned to garage number 4 last week." comment. How are they assigned?

[westopher]

I think all that aligns with is that someone couldn’t have put the noose there with the intention that bubba was going to be in there. Still though, that doesn’t clarify for me that someone didn’t assign him to that garage knowing the noose was there. Again I’m not trying to act like I know something that none of us do. Just putting a possibility out there that seems to be ignored in the reporting/conclusion of the investigation.

[welfare]

All of the stalls were remodeled and finished in 2019. Many of the earlier stalls from 2017 used pull cords fashioned in the exact same way prior to being refinished.
Some of the refinished stalls used pull cords fashioned similarly, but not exactly, the same as his stall. From what I've gathered.

I think it's going pretty far down a rabbit hole to suspect that someone would assign him that stall just because it had a pull cord in the shape of a noose. Which isn't an uncommon knot, especially for something like a handle.
Unless there's evidence to prove that theory, I'll assume what seems most likely. That it's just a handle and people are letting hysteria cloud there judgment.
That's just my opinion though.

[underscore]

Originally Posted by welfare

I think it's going pretty far down a rabbit hole to suspect that someone would assign him that stall just because it had a pull cord in the shape of a noose.

Normally I would tend to agree, but with everything I've seen lately it's hardly outside the realm of possibilities. Just look at the amount of time, money and effort someone put into flying that stupid defund NASCAR flag behind a plane at Talledega.

[welfare]

Him and his crew had probably seen it, walked past it, and put their hands on it hundreds of times without so much as a second thought.
The rope didn't all of a sudden transform into a noose. Nothing about it changed.
The only thing that changed is what's inside people's mind.

[Manic!]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...sion-1.5627792

Toronto police officer found guilty of assault, brother not guilty, in Dafonte Miller beating case

Spoiler!

A Toronto police officer has been found guilty of assault in the beating of a young Black man more than three years ago, while his brother has been acquitted of all charges.

Michael Theriault was convicted of assault on Friday, but found not guilty of aggravated assault or obstruction of justice in relation to the Dec. 28, 2016 incident involving Dafonte Miller, which left him blinded in one eye.

The officer's brother, Christian Theriault, was acquitted of aggravated assault and obstruction of justice.

Ontario Superior Court Justice Joseph Di Luca said the case, and others like it, "raise significant issues involving race and policing that should be further examined."

But he said his task was not to conduct a public inquiry on race and policing, or to deliver the verdict sought by the public — it was to determine the case based on the evidence.

While a decision like this would usually come in court, the ongoing COVID-19 pandemic led to the hearing being broadcast live on YouTube, with over 19,000 viewers tuning in.

Miller, family speak out

After the verdict, Miller, now 22, and his mother held a news conference to show appreciation for the community that supported them.

"It's meant a lot to me in these last few years," he said. "It's helped me go forward."

Miller recalls the night of the incident and said, "We've come a long way."

"Now, we're in a situation where an officer has been held accountable to some extent," adding that he wants to continue to raise awareness for those who are in his position but may not have the resources and support he has had.

"There's a lot of people who are in my position who don't get the same backing that I got and don't get to have their day to really have any vindication for what they're going through."

Police chief to speak

Michael Theriault is currently suspended with pay, Toronto police spokesperson Meaghan Gray said in an email before the verdict was handed down.

"The internal disciplinary process is held until the conclusion of the criminal proceedings," she wrote.

Toronto police Chief Mark Saunders spoke to the media about the decision of the trial on Friday afternoon.

Mike McCormack, the president of the Toronto Police Association, would not comment on the decision saying "the matter is still before the court pending sentence."
Vastly different versions

Michael Theriault, who was off duty that night in 2016, and his younger brother, Christian, both had pleaded not guilty, telling the court Miller attacked them that night and they were defending themselves, putting forth a case of self-defence.

The Crown contended there was no justification for the beating Miller suffered that night.

Miller, who was 19 at the time of the incident, said he was walking down a residential street in the early morning hours in Whitby, Ont. — more than 50 kilometres east of Toronto — with two friends. He testified that the brothers, who were at their father's house, came outside and questioned them. He told the court he ran and the Theriaults chased him, catching up to him between two houses.
He said they beat him — punching, kicking and hitting him with an object. He made his way to the front of a home and banged on the door for help, but the beating continued.

Homeowner James Silverthorn, a district chief with Toronto Fire Services, was a Crown witness. He said he woke up even before the banging on the door to the sounds of screaming.

He looked through his side window and saw two men beating another man.

"It was continuous. It was very hard," he told the court.

He said later, when the men had moved to the front of his house, he saw one man holding an object, stabbing down with it, to keep the man on the ground from getting up.

A long metal pole with blood on it was found at the scene.

The Theriault brothers told the court they caught Miller and one of his friends breaking into their parents' vehicle and that they were trying to apprehend him.

They testified that once they caught up to him, Miller was the one with a pipe and that he was hitting them.

Michael Theriault admitted in court that he punched Miller repeatedly, as hard as he could, trying to disarm him. He said he and his brother feared for their lives.

In written closing submissions, the defence wrote: "This case is not about race."

The narratives put forward by Miller and his lawyer "bear no resemblance to what actually happened," their submission reads.

The defence lawyers also argued Miller lied in court when he denied breaking into cars that night.

Prosecutors said even if Miller was breaking into cars, the severe beating that caused him to lose his left eye was not justified.

The case has drawn attention to issues of anti-Black racism and police brutality, spurring protests in solidarity with Miller and his family.

The demonstrators, sporting T-shirts that read "Justice for Dafonte" gathered outside the Oshawa Ont., courthouse even though the hearing did not take place there.

The cop is suspended but is still being paid.

[SkinnyPupp]

Twitter

[StylinRed]

Originally Posted by westopher

I think all that aligns with is that someone couldn’t have put the noose there with the intention that bubba was going to be in there. Still though, that doesn’t clarify for me that someone didn’t assign him to that garage knowing the noose was there. Again I’m not trying to act like I know something that none of us do. Just putting a possibility out there that seems to be ignored in the reporting/conclusion of the investigation.

did some googling

looks like theres video evidence from years back (track/garage walkthroughs) that showed the noose pullcord in all/almost all garages

here's a pic of screencap I think, its from a right-wing site though (I assume)

[Nlkko]

NASCAR's swift action is commendable. Imagine if the incident was intentional and they didn't do enough. Whether or not somebody intentionally put it there is moot. They did the right thing as an organization, even when their fan base has a lot of MAGA.

It is as simple as treating others the way you want to be treated and speak out even if staying silent is self-beneficial. NASCAR spoke out, loud and clear for the people in the back too. This is how you stop radical, extreme ideal from manifest.

[welfare]

Originally Posted by Nlkko

NASCAR's swift action is commendable. Imagine if the incident was intentional and they didn't do enough. Whether or not somebody intentionally put it there is moot. They did the right thing as an organization, even when their fan base has a lot of MAGA.

You're right. Intention is completely irrelevant. All that matters is that the worst possible conclusion is drawn prior to any sort of investigation.
Who cares if it's the truth or not

[welfare]

This guy got arrested for pulling a gun, then released the same day. just three hours later he ended up fatally shooting a seven year old girl in the head.
Rest assured, no fake nooses were involved. I guess BLM can sit tight on this one.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ased-jail.html

[SkinnyPupp]

Welfare nobody going to take your bait, but do keep posting black crime if it makes you feel good

[welfare]

Originally Posted by SkinnyPupp

Welfare nobody going to take your bait, but do keep posting black crime if it makes you feel good

Behind every violent crime is a victim.
But do keep posting the removal of flags/statues/monuments/police. Probably doesn't mean much to the victims of this astronomically disproportionate level of violent crime. But sure feels good, don't it?

[SkinnyPupp]

Originally Posted by welfare

Behind every violent crime is a victim.
But do keep posting the removal of flags/statues/monuments/police. Probably doesn't mean much to the victims of this astronomically disproportionate level of violent crime. But sure feels good, don't it?

Originally Posted by SkinnyPupp

Welfare nobody going to take your bait

[welfare]

You can call it bait, sure.
The same way you can call Catholics praying in front of a statue, far right Nazis and skinheads.

https://youtu.be/yFvXJ8W93Cg

https://youtu.be/UeBJB1SACTs